| Abolish party got abolished 16:45 - May 8 with 8281 views | CwmafanJack |
Glad to see the back of these English/ Brit nat anti welsh scum! I don't think they got over a thousand votes in any constituency, honestly laughable to think the senedd was going anywhere when upwards of 70% of the Welsh population are pro devolution.
Cymru rydd ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ |  |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 13:19 - May 9 with 1299 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 12:43 - May 9 by Catullus |
Oh good grief, Drakeford has stated time and again that he is not for indy.
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/welsh-independence-drakeford-yes-cym
Your comments about the tories are wrong too, Wales has turned slightly more tory. The general election started it and the Welsh tories have won more seats than ever before. That's not an opinion, it's a fact.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-57031725
Plaid Cymru did worse than they expected, Price even lost votes in his own seat. On the Welsh politics show this morning James Williams stated that the latest Yougov poll said 21% supported indy but 27% supported abolish.
Labour are pro union and claiming (now that Plaid has stalled) more than half their voters are indy supporters goes very much against the evidence.
I couldn't vote Abolish in the end, I watched the debate and the leader was very anti Welsh in my view. I am Welsh AND British and proud of it. |
You got that wrong, Plaid did not do worse than expected at all, not in my book anyway as I got it almost smack on, CountyJim put up an article about a poll just before the election and I commented ''that's more like it'', it had Labour at 40%, Cons at 30% and Plaid at 19%, I agreed with the poll the actual scores were Labour 40% (basically smack on) Tories not quite as good as expected at 26% and Plaid at 20% in Plaids case it was slightly better than they or I expected.
As regards Rhondda I knew it was going back to Labour weeks ago, I was told by my workmate who lives there and who's wife is friends with Leanne that it was Labours #1 target and that Labour had their own younger version of Leanne Wood doing stuff for the community just like Leanne has done for decades and that Labour was certain to win (and he was voting Plaid).. |  |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 13:35 - May 9 with 1287 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 13:19 - May 9 by trampie |
You got that wrong, Plaid did not do worse than expected at all, not in my book anyway as I got it almost smack on, CountyJim put up an article about a poll just before the election and I commented ''that's more like it'', it had Labour at 40%, Cons at 30% and Plaid at 19%, I agreed with the poll the actual scores were Labour 40% (basically smack on) Tories not quite as good as expected at 26% and Plaid at 20% in Plaids case it was slightly better than they or I expected.
As regards Rhondda I knew it was going back to Labour weeks ago, I was told by my workmate who lives there and who's wife is friends with Leanne that it was Labours #1 target and that Labour had their own younger version of Leanne Wood doing stuff for the community just like Leanne has done for decades and that Labour was certain to win (and he was voting Plaid).. |
I didn't get it wrong at all but yet again you did. You're making an art form out of it.
What you said or what a poll says don't matter, what did Adam Price say?
https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/19274306.plaid-cymru-bullish-welsh-labour
Thsi extract says it all,
Despite being seen as Labour’s most likely coalition party, Plaid Cymru leader Adam Price refused to be drawn on future compromises, claiming instead he expected a “historic result” for his party.
So there you go Tramps, Plaid Cymru's leader expected to do well, he expected "surging support" and it didn't happen therefore Plaid did worse than they expected as they actually lost voter share.
You really need to remember to seperate your own opinion out from the facts. What you or I say carries very little weight beyond our front doorstep. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 13:46 - May 9 with 1276 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 13:35 - May 9 by Catullus |
I didn't get it wrong at all but yet again you did. You're making an art form out of it.
What you said or what a poll says don't matter, what did Adam Price say?
https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/19274306.plaid-cymru-bullish-welsh-labour
Thsi extract says it all,
Despite being seen as Labour’s most likely coalition party, Plaid Cymru leader Adam Price refused to be drawn on future compromises, claiming instead he expected a “historic result” for his party.
So there you go Tramps, Plaid Cymru's leader expected to do well, he expected "surging support" and it didn't happen therefore Plaid did worse than they expected as they actually lost voter share.
You really need to remember to seperate your own opinion out from the facts. What you or I say carries very little weight beyond our front doorstep. |
The facts are I was correct Plaid got 20% of the vote, Plaids leader has got to say he expects his party to do well (90% of the time just like a football manager, it's their job to try and motivate).
When you follow events like I do most of the time you know what likely outcomes are going to be, it's not rocket science just a lack of bias and common sense required. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:02 - May 9 with 1267 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 13:46 - May 9 by trampie |
The facts are I was correct Plaid got 20% of the vote, Plaids leader has got to say he expects his party to do well (90% of the time just like a football manager, it's their job to try and motivate).
When you follow events like I do most of the time you know what likely outcomes are going to be, it's not rocket science just a lack of bias and common sense required. |
So when Prrice comes out, after the event, and says Plaid had a disappointing set of results, he doesn't really mean it?
Are you calling Price a liar? Is that what you think of the leader of the party you vote for?
I don't remember you predicting the tories winning a record number of Welsh seats? You followed events, when did you ever say it was the likely outcome?
Lack of bias, common sense, that's comedy gold. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:08 - May 9 with 1262 views | raynor94 |
| Abolish party got abolished on 13:46 - May 9 by trampie |
The facts are I was correct Plaid got 20% of the vote, Plaids leader has got to say he expects his party to do well (90% of the time just like a football manager, it's their job to try and motivate).
When you follow events like I do most of the time you know what likely outcomes are going to be, it's not rocket science just a lack of bias and common sense required. |
Jesus, another one in full reverse  |  |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:12 - May 9 with 1251 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:02 - May 9 by Catullus |
So when Prrice comes out, after the event, and says Plaid had a disappointing set of results, he doesn't really mean it?
Are you calling Price a liar? Is that what you think of the leader of the party you vote for?
I don't remember you predicting the tories winning a record number of Welsh seats? You followed events, when did you ever say it was the likely outcome?
Lack of bias, common sense, that's comedy gold. |
I did think the Tories would win a record amount of seats, I agreed with the article about the poll put up by County Jim and I said so, it meant Labour winning well and the Tories doing the best they have done in a Senedd election and Plaid treading water with the Lib-Dems and UKIP and Abolish all doing badly. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:15 - May 9 with 1249 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:12 - May 9 by trampie |
I did think the Tories would win a record amount of seats, I agreed with the article about the poll put up by County Jim and I said so, it meant Labour winning well and the Tories doing the best they have done in a Senedd election and Plaid treading water with the Lib-Dems and UKIP and Abolish all doing badly. |
Put the link up then, lets see how much of a genius you are. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:20 - May 9 with 1246 views | krunchykarrot |
| Abolish party got abolished on 22:05 - May 8 by Flashberryjack |
I voted to get rid of dithering Drakeford and the rest of the Cardiff gravy train. |
I live in Neath id vote for Captain Beany if i could get rid of Labour and the Bay cabal. |  | | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:32 - May 9 with 1234 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:15 - May 9 by Catullus |
Put the link up then, lets see how much of a genius you are. |
21st April I wrote the following :-
"Now that poll is how I expect things to go, i follow the fortunes of Plaid and I don't think they will do as well as some people expect, I think Drakeford will win his seat (no McEvoy for Plaid) and Labour might get the Rhondda back, it's traditionally one of the safest seats for Labour in the UK, but Ms Wood personal vote won it last time out against the odds, Labour are said to be campaigning hard with a young Labour version of Leanne, so there will be some interesting seats out there.
People returning to Labour due to less negative press than what they had under Corbyn should boost their figures, huge English immigration should boost the Conservatives figures, with the others squeezed, I hope the Greens put up a bit of a show but won't hold my breath on that one."
I take it you are suitably impressed, well before the election and fairs fair if I say so myself, If you want any predictions in the future just let me know. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:40 - May 9 with 1227 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:32 - May 9 by trampie |
21st April I wrote the following :-
"Now that poll is how I expect things to go, i follow the fortunes of Plaid and I don't think they will do as well as some people expect, I think Drakeford will win his seat (no McEvoy for Plaid) and Labour might get the Rhondda back, it's traditionally one of the safest seats for Labour in the UK, but Ms Wood personal vote won it last time out against the odds, Labour are said to be campaigning hard with a young Labour version of Leanne, so there will be some interesting seats out there.
People returning to Labour due to less negative press than what they had under Corbyn should boost their figures, huge English immigration should boost the Conservatives figures, with the others squeezed, I hope the Greens put up a bit of a show but won't hold my breath on that one."
I take it you are suitably impressed, well before the election and fairs fair if I say so myself, If you want any predictions in the future just let me know. |
You didn't predict a record night for the tories just that they'd boost their numbers. It's all irrelevant anyway because where I have been pushing you is on Price's opinion and the opinion of many others on tv, that Plaid Cymru had a disappointing night. You can be right, it has to happen sometimes for all of us. Still, when the PC leader, when the news reporters and the media are calling it disappointing, you don't really get over rule the leader of your own party.
Still, I asked for the link. I'd like to be able to read the thread for context. Which thread was it then? | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:45 - May 9 with 1218 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:40 - May 9 by Catullus |
You didn't predict a record night for the tories just that they'd boost their numbers. It's all irrelevant anyway because where I have been pushing you is on Price's opinion and the opinion of many others on tv, that Plaid Cymru had a disappointing night. You can be right, it has to happen sometimes for all of us. Still, when the PC leader, when the news reporters and the media are calling it disappointing, you don't really get over rule the leader of your own party.
Still, I asked for the link. I'd like to be able to read the thread for context. Which thread was it then? |
Cat I'm nearly always right and let me tell you why, I'm not biased that is why, people over the years don't like me online because I'm hard to debate against, why I will tell you why because I don't lie and I have no bias, so I back up what I say, you will learn that, I think you are learning that already aren't you buttie.  | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 16:11 - May 9 with 1171 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:45 - May 9 by trampie |
Cat I'm nearly always right and let me tell you why, I'm not biased that is why, people over the years don't like me online because I'm hard to debate against, why I will tell you why because I don't lie and I have no bias, so I back up what I say, you will learn that, I think you are learning that already aren't you buttie. |
ðŸ‘ðŸ¾ðŸ‘ðŸ¾ðŸ‘ðŸ¾ðŸ‘🾠|  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Abolish party got abolished on 16:20 - May 9 with 1162 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Abolish party got abolished on 12:43 - May 9 by Catullus |
Oh good grief, Drakeford has stated time and again that he is not for indy.
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/welsh-independence-drakeford-yes-cym
Your comments about the tories are wrong too, Wales has turned slightly more tory. The general election started it and the Welsh tories have won more seats than ever before. That's not an opinion, it's a fact.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-57031725
Plaid Cymru did worse than they expected, Price even lost votes in his own seat. On the Welsh politics show this morning James Williams stated that the latest Yougov poll said 21% supported indy but 27% supported abolish.
Labour are pro union and claiming (now that Plaid has stalled) more than half their voters are indy supporters goes very much against the evidence.
I couldn't vote Abolish in the end, I watched the debate and the leader was very anti Welsh in my view. I am Welsh AND British and proud of it. |
This is a classic.
You cannot be serious on May 9 to quote a youGov poll putting Abolish at 27%.
😂😂😂
Cymru voted on Thursday in a real election so we have no need for youGov.
I can tell you how much support Abolish actually has.
1.6% in the Constituences.
3.7% in the Regional list.
Abolish is dead. Its a good day for Cymru. ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿
We dont want your Wales-shire. | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Abolish party got abolished on 17:31 - May 9 with 1130 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Abolish party got abolished on 21:59 - May 8 by Boundy |
Far away a voice is calling
Bells of memory chime
Come home again, come home again
They call through the oceans of time
We'll keep a welcome in the hillsides,
We'll keep a welcome in the Vales |
Always hated that song.
Its just too happy clappy for me. Sorry.
You can’t beat our National anthem, its the best in the world.
A masterpiece fit for Gods Own Country.
‘O bydded i'r heniaith barhau’.
That line will always speak for Wales. | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Abolish party got abolished on 19:07 - May 9 with 1095 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 14:45 - May 9 by trampie |
Cat I'm nearly always right and let me tell you why, I'm not biased that is why, people over the years don't like me online because I'm hard to debate against, why I will tell you why because I don't lie and I have no bias, so I back up what I say, you will learn that, I think you are learning that already aren't you buttie. |
Hard to debate against....pal you are the easiest mark on here. You want hard try Dr Parnassus.
My 12 year old son makes more sense than you. If you are not biased then how come you are openly stating you vote Plaid? You cannot claim a political position and then claim no bias. At the very least you are biased towards Plaid Cymru. You don't lie you say, well being wrong isn't a lie and you manage it a lot.
There is only one other poster on here who is told he is wrong anywhere near as often as you and he's a Plaid Cymru voter too! | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 19:42 - May 9 with 1082 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 16:20 - May 9 by Kilkennyjack |
This is a classic.
You cannot be serious on May 9 to quote a youGov poll putting Abolish at 27%.
😂😂😂
Cymru voted on Thursday in a real election so we have no need for youGov.
I can tell you how much support Abolish actually has.
1.6% in the Constituences.
3.7% in the Regional list.
Abolish is dead. Its a good day for Cymru. ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿
We dont want your Wales-shire. |
The result of the poll is still the result of the poll. Maybe a lot of people were like myself and knew a vote for abolish was definitely wasted? You see people can have strongly held beliefs but still be pragmatic.
You say abolish is dead but maybe it's just the start for them, they are far more recent than Plaid Cymru and from little acorns grow mighty Oaks...or they may disappear up their on exhaust pipe. Who knows. If Abolish has a leader who comes across as less of an anti Welsh twunt they may pick up.
66% of the vote went to pro union parties who support what you call Wales-shire. Suck it up buttercup. Adam price has sucked it up and admitted what a bad day it was for Plaid, your turn now. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 20:17 - May 9 with 1072 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 19:07 - May 9 by Catullus |
Hard to debate against....pal you are the easiest mark on here. You want hard try Dr Parnassus.
My 12 year old son makes more sense than you. If you are not biased then how come you are openly stating you vote Plaid? You cannot claim a political position and then claim no bias. At the very least you are biased towards Plaid Cymru. You don't lie you say, well being wrong isn't a lie and you manage it a lot.
There is only one other poster on here who is told he is wrong anywhere near as often as you and he's a Plaid Cymru voter too! |
What am I wrong about ?
Not every voter is biased because they vote for one party or another, I said Plaid wasn't going to do as well as people thought, I knew Drakeford would beat them in Cardiff and that Leanne would lose to them in the Rhondda, no bias there see butt. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 21:10 - May 9 with 1057 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Abolish party got abolished on 19:42 - May 9 by Catullus |
The result of the poll is still the result of the poll. Maybe a lot of people were like myself and knew a vote for abolish was definitely wasted? You see people can have strongly held beliefs but still be pragmatic.
You say abolish is dead but maybe it's just the start for them, they are far more recent than Plaid Cymru and from little acorns grow mighty Oaks...or they may disappear up their on exhaust pipe. Who knows. If Abolish has a leader who comes across as less of an anti Welsh twunt they may pick up.
66% of the vote went to pro union parties who support what you call Wales-shire. Suck it up buttercup. Adam price has sucked it up and admitted what a bad day it was for Plaid, your turn now. |
At least there is £13,000 they wont be seeing again.
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| Beware of the Risen People
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| Abolish party got abolished on 09:18 - May 10 with 1016 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
Liberal Democrats - slowly disappearing? |  |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 09:48 - May 10 with 1011 views | Catullus |
| Abolish party got abolished on 20:17 - May 9 by trampie |
What am I wrong about ?
Not every voter is biased because they vote for one party or another, I said Plaid wasn't going to do as well as people thought, I knew Drakeford would beat them in Cardiff and that Leanne would lose to them in the Rhondda, no bias there see butt. |
As soon as you pick a side you imply bias, it doesn't mean you can't give a realisitic opinion though. Now bias, how do you feel about tories and right wing voters?
How about.....how do you feel about English people coming to live in Wales?
We all have bias of some kind.
Maybe I should use your own words against you, what was it you said about Price, he was pretending to be confident, something like that. How about when you made your "predictions" you were pretending to be downbeat so you could claim a bigger victory if Plaid did as well as Price was claiming they would?
You still didn't answer the question though, do you think Price was lying when he said the results wer disappointing?
Do you think these were the results he was really expecting?
BTW, I can't think of anyone who thought Drakeford would lose his seat.
I managed to find something Vaughn Gething said that I totally agree with too,
“The message for all of us is keep on listening to what the public are saying.
“Don’t tell the public they’re wrong when they vote, try to understand why they’ve chosen to vote in a different way. You can’t simply assume that people will continue to vote for you as a result of old tribal loyalty.”
Tribal loyalty should be dead, people should think more about how they vote.
Socrates believed the only true evil was ignorance, there's lots of it around. I'm pretty ignorant but not as bad as some. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 11:11 - May 10 with 988 views | Joe_bradshaw |
Price was clearly relishing the prospect of him and his party propping up a minority Labour administration. His comments about not being a minor party in a coalition said it all. He thought Plaid were going to hold the balance of power (to be fair, many pundits thought that would be the case), and he was loving it. He got a slap in the face and Plaid have ended up very much the third party in the Senedd.
I think he would have got more respect from the Welsh electorate if he had ruled out any possible coalition and said that the Plaid members would vote on every issue as it arose in the way that they considered would be the best for the people of Wales. That would keep the Labour administration at arms length whilst maintaining independence of thought.
Plaid are Labour lite and if you want left of centre government in Wales you may as well vote for the real thing and vote Labour. |  |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 12:29 - May 10 with 973 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 09:48 - May 10 by Catullus |
As soon as you pick a side you imply bias, it doesn't mean you can't give a realisitic opinion though. Now bias, how do you feel about tories and right wing voters?
How about.....how do you feel about English people coming to live in Wales?
We all have bias of some kind.
Maybe I should use your own words against you, what was it you said about Price, he was pretending to be confident, something like that. How about when you made your "predictions" you were pretending to be downbeat so you could claim a bigger victory if Plaid did as well as Price was claiming they would?
You still didn't answer the question though, do you think Price was lying when he said the results wer disappointing?
Do you think these were the results he was really expecting?
BTW, I can't think of anyone who thought Drakeford would lose his seat.
I managed to find something Vaughn Gething said that I totally agree with too,
“The message for all of us is keep on listening to what the public are saying.
“Don’t tell the public they’re wrong when they vote, try to understand why they’ve chosen to vote in a different way. You can’t simply assume that people will continue to vote for you as a result of old tribal loyalty.”
Tribal loyalty should be dead, people should think more about how they vote.
Socrates believed the only true evil was ignorance, there's lots of it around. I'm pretty ignorant but not as bad as some. |
I think Tories are true to themselves and look after themselves and people of their ilk as long as they have means, when the Tories win I respect democracy and think too myself ok then the people have spoken now let's have it, more tax cuts, more tax breaks as regards pensions and incentives to save.
The Tories usually make me personally richer but I don't vote for what is best for myself, I vote for what I think is best for the country.
No issue with English people coming to live in Wales as long as the UK state pay the bill (for the strain on the economy and NHS as they tend to be older and make provision for affordable homes in such areas for young locals).
I'm not a party member and I want to be correct not wrong, I'm not a politician playing games, I call it as I see it.
I haven't seen what Price said but I don't think he was lying he is in a political bubble with people telling him what they think he wants to hear, which will no doubt be encouraging. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 12:37 - May 10 with 969 views | trampie |
| Abolish party got abolished on 11:11 - May 10 by Joe_bradshaw |
Price was clearly relishing the prospect of him and his party propping up a minority Labour administration. His comments about not being a minor party in a coalition said it all. He thought Plaid were going to hold the balance of power (to be fair, many pundits thought that would be the case), and he was loving it. He got a slap in the face and Plaid have ended up very much the third party in the Senedd.
I think he would have got more respect from the Welsh electorate if he had ruled out any possible coalition and said that the Plaid members would vote on every issue as it arose in the way that they considered would be the best for the people of Wales. That would keep the Labour administration at arms length whilst maintaining independence of thought.
Plaid are Labour lite and if you want left of centre government in Wales you may as well vote for the real thing and vote Labour. |
Quite a few people of my generation left Labour for Plaid because Labour became right wing, I did so over a third of a century ago, so it's not accurate to call Plaid Labour lite with Plaid being left and Labour being on the right during most of that time (with the exception of Corbyn in UK Labour, Drakeford is left but is subservient to Westminster Tory lite Labour).
There is now no point in people voting Labour as Labour are never going to get in at Westminster the English have spoken and they are all Tories, therefore voting Labour in a General Election is a wasted vote, may as well vote Plaid, at least there would be the threat of a breakaway just like the SNP in Westminster. | |
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| Abolish party got abolished on 14:16 - May 10 with 953 views | Joe_bradshaw |
| Abolish party got abolished on 12:37 - May 10 by trampie |
Quite a few people of my generation left Labour for Plaid because Labour became right wing, I did so over a third of a century ago, so it's not accurate to call Plaid Labour lite with Plaid being left and Labour being on the right during most of that time (with the exception of Corbyn in UK Labour, Drakeford is left but is subservient to Westminster Tory lite Labour).
There is now no point in people voting Labour as Labour are never going to get in at Westminster the English have spoken and they are all Tories, therefore voting Labour in a General Election is a wasted vote, may as well vote Plaid, at least there would be the threat of a breakaway just like the SNP in Westminster. |
None of my comments were about a general election, they were all about last week's Welsh election. Apart from independence Drakeford and Price are extremely close in policy thus in Wales Plaid are Labour lite and only worth voting for if you support independence. This is borne out by the figures of around 20% support.
Price needs to offer something different from Labour and maybe needs to learn from the SNP. Not everyone who votes SNP supports an independent Scotland. The SNP has been very successful in presenting itself as the party that represents the people of Scotland as opposed to the two main London based GB wide main parties. Plaid needs to portray Labour as a London based party that will ultimately toe the London centric line whereas Plaid represents the people of Wales whether you support independence or not.
It's not easy, Covid cast a big shadow over last week's election and the ruling parties in all three countries did well. Maybe next time Covid and Brexit will be well behind us and things will be more normal. | |
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