| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 11:48 - Nov 22 with 1346 views | PatfromPoole |
Point of order.
If one is only to judge players by what they do in the future (as you are purporting to opine in the case of Manning), how can you ever actually judge them???!!!!???
As there will always be games in the future.
Manning was pretty useless against Millwall and West Brom BTW.
Gave the ball away twice in short succession v Millwall, and then v West Brom was completely statuesque for their header that hit the bar at 1-1; he let their guy have an unchallenged header. He was and has consistently been a complete liability defensively and Bree has to start ahead of him. [Post edited 22 Nov 2023 12:18]
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 12:05 - Nov 22 with 1320 views | Butty101 |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 11:48 - Nov 22 by PatfromPoole |
Point of order.
If one is only to judge players by what they do in the future (as you are purporting to opine in the case of Manning), how can you ever actually judge them???!!!!???
As there will always be games in the future.
Manning was pretty useless against Millwall and West Brom BTW.
Gave the ball away twice in short succession v Millwall, and then v West Brom was completely statuesque for their header that hit the bar at 1-1; he let their guy have an unchallenged header. He was and has consistently been a complete liability defensively and Bree has to start ahead of him. [Post edited 22 Nov 2023 12:18]
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I would add Bree has not been maligned. Hes not had a chance up to now |  |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 12:28 - Nov 22 with 1301 views | saintwizzler |
When chatting with my QPR Season Ticket holder work hun about signing Manning, he did say “he’s not a defender, he played Left Midfield for us. Great going forward but can’t defend.”
I guess The Manager Formally Known As Rusty started him on his Left Back career in South Wales.
Bree is definitely the ‘safer’ option at Left Back even though being played out of position.
He has done well there.
WE HIS NAME IS A CHEESE ON |  |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:12 - Nov 22 with 1250 views | SaintNick |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 11:48 - Nov 22 by PatfromPoole |
Point of order.
If one is only to judge players by what they do in the future (as you are purporting to opine in the case of Manning), how can you ever actually judge them???!!!!???
As there will always be games in the future.
Manning was pretty useless against Millwall and West Brom BTW.
Gave the ball away twice in short succession v Millwall, and then v West Brom was completely statuesque for their header that hit the bar at 1-1; he let their guy have an unchallenged header. He was and has consistently been a complete liability defensively and Bree has to start ahead of him. [Post edited 22 Nov 2023 12:18]
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I meant going forward from now not just judge him on what happened in the past, I was a lone voice in the summer regarding Adam Armstrong about the fact that many judged him on his games in the Premier League and he had now dropped down to the Championship where he was proven.
Im not sure what Ryan Manning has ever done to you, has he dissed Poole in a holiday video or something.
If we take Manning's stats, you are always highly critical of Manning's passing, but if we look at his stats in this, he has passed the ball 963 times in his Championship games, he has a pass completion of 854, that is 88.68 pass completion rate
This puts him above 94% of players in the Championship.
You say he was pretty useless against both Millwall & West Brom, yet against West Brom he came on to the pitch at a time when West Brom had just equalised after dominating the game for the previous 20 minutes and played a part in the winning goal by passing the ball to Fraser.
Yes he did get outjumped for the header, but so do most full backs in that situation, it could be said that he prevented their player getting a free header on goal and picking his spot, have you taken to task our player who left the West Brom man completely free for the header that hit the underside of the bar, clue it wasn't Manning he wasn't on the pitch.
Against Millwall he came on as we got on top of the game and was part of a side that dominated the last 20 minutes and achieved a victory. Bree had done his job and we were now on top, it was time to bring on a more attacking player
Would we have been able to do that in both games carrying a passenger as you are stating.
In these two games, was Manning the only man outjumped for a header ? the only man who gave the ball away ?
Manning may not have had a great start to his Saints career, but he has played a part in our revival, he played the full game in the first 4 games of our unbeaten run and after missing the next two, has come on in the last two games at a time when we were drawing a game and subsequently won it.
To say he has been a complete liability defensively is just not true, in his time on the pitch in the last 8 games, we have conceded just 3 goals in the 403 minutes plus injury time that he has been on the pitch.
Ive nothing against James Bree whom I think has played well, but in the 2 games Manning didn't play any part we conceded 3 goals in just 180 minutes.
Stats are stats and not always a great judge of how a player is playing, but most clubs these days look at them in detail.
All I am saying is give Manning a chance, you have an unhealthy hatred of him |  |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:36 - Nov 22 with 1225 views | Berber |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 11:48 - Nov 22 by PatfromPoole |
Point of order.
If one is only to judge players by what they do in the future (as you are purporting to opine in the case of Manning), how can you ever actually judge them???!!!!???
As there will always be games in the future.
Manning was pretty useless against Millwall and West Brom BTW.
Gave the ball away twice in short succession v Millwall, and then v West Brom was completely statuesque for their header that hit the bar at 1-1; he let their guy have an unchallenged header. He was and has consistently been a complete liability defensively and Bree has to start ahead of him. [Post edited 22 Nov 2023 12:18]
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This, Manning cannot be played unless our central defence is sound. It has been better of late, but still too many goals conceded against feeble opposition. Playing someone who increases the chances of the opposition scoring is not the way to go. Bree got stick last season because of the oaf Jone’s insistence in putting him in, where he was mediocre at best in the PL. as a consequence, KWP was shifted and Perraud missed out.
To prioritise Manning over Perraud was crassness of the first order, and another example of aspiring manager’s misplaced self pride. Bree over Manning any day of the week though for me. |  | | |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:37 - Nov 22 with 1224 views | PatfromPoole |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:12 - Nov 22 by SaintNick |
I meant going forward from now not just judge him on what happened in the past, I was a lone voice in the summer regarding Adam Armstrong about the fact that many judged him on his games in the Premier League and he had now dropped down to the Championship where he was proven.
Im not sure what Ryan Manning has ever done to you, has he dissed Poole in a holiday video or something.
If we take Manning's stats, you are always highly critical of Manning's passing, but if we look at his stats in this, he has passed the ball 963 times in his Championship games, he has a pass completion of 854, that is 88.68 pass completion rate
This puts him above 94% of players in the Championship.
You say he was pretty useless against both Millwall & West Brom, yet against West Brom he came on to the pitch at a time when West Brom had just equalised after dominating the game for the previous 20 minutes and played a part in the winning goal by passing the ball to Fraser.
Yes he did get outjumped for the header, but so do most full backs in that situation, it could be said that he prevented their player getting a free header on goal and picking his spot, have you taken to task our player who left the West Brom man completely free for the header that hit the underside of the bar, clue it wasn't Manning he wasn't on the pitch.
Against Millwall he came on as we got on top of the game and was part of a side that dominated the last 20 minutes and achieved a victory. Bree had done his job and we were now on top, it was time to bring on a more attacking player
Would we have been able to do that in both games carrying a passenger as you are stating.
In these two games, was Manning the only man outjumped for a header ? the only man who gave the ball away ?
Manning may not have had a great start to his Saints career, but he has played a part in our revival, he played the full game in the first 4 games of our unbeaten run and after missing the next two, has come on in the last two games at a time when we were drawing a game and subsequently won it.
To say he has been a complete liability defensively is just not true, in his time on the pitch in the last 8 games, we have conceded just 3 goals in the 403 minutes plus injury time that he has been on the pitch.
Ive nothing against James Bree whom I think has played well, but in the 2 games Manning didn't play any part we conceded 3 goals in just 180 minutes.
Stats are stats and not always a great judge of how a player is playing, but most clubs these days look at them in detail.
All I am saying is give Manning a chance, you have an unhealthy hatred of him |
I don’t have an unhealthy hatred of him.
He is just an obvious weak link, as he is so poor defensively.
First 3 games of the season; Norwich’s 4th goal and Plymouth’s goal. Both crucial goals which could have cost us a number of points. Schoolboy errors by him.
He is regularly bailed out by Harwood-Bellis and Bednarek.
His pass completion stats will be high, as 80% of his passes are straight forward passes to either a CB or a CM, often putting the CM in trouble, I would add.
I struggle to see what he adds. He is slow, his positional sense is not good; his set-pieces are usually poor, and he shows little sign of having a meaningful link-up with Sulemana.
I’m just pleased that even Martin seems to be able to see that Bree is the better defender. | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:54 - Nov 22 with 1208 views | SaintNick |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:37 - Nov 22 by PatfromPoole |
I don’t have an unhealthy hatred of him.
He is just an obvious weak link, as he is so poor defensively.
First 3 games of the season; Norwich’s 4th goal and Plymouth’s goal. Both crucial goals which could have cost us a number of points. Schoolboy errors by him.
He is regularly bailed out by Harwood-Bellis and Bednarek.
His pass completion stats will be high, as 80% of his passes are straight forward passes to either a CB or a CM, often putting the CM in trouble, I would add.
I struggle to see what he adds. He is slow, his positional sense is not good; his set-pieces are usually poor, and he shows little sign of having a meaningful link-up with Sulemana.
I’m just pleased that even Martin seems to be able to see that Bree is the better defender. |
What did i say, stop harking on about the first games of the season, they are long gone, for the Plymouth goal he actually slipped on the turf, something that he was not alone in doing that day.
Again you dont look at his pass ratio in saying that 80 % of his passes are simple, he has 2 assists , only 1 behind Sulemana & Adam Armstrong, he has played 20 key passes that is as many as Adam Armstrong and better than 88% of all Championship players, so to say most of his passes are simple is not proven by stats.
He has put in 81 crosses, more than 97% of the other players and more importantly he has a cross completion rate of 16 out of 81 that is more than 92 % of the rest of the division and a completion rate in terms of percentage of 20% which is in the top half of the division.
You are right is defending stats arent great, Bree's are better, but Bree came into a side that was now defending properly and well, Manning was in one that was poor and it wasn't all his fault, Bednarek and THB are more prone to passing to the central midfielders and putting them in trouble than Manning.
With regards to having a succesful link up with Sulemana, that is difficult for anyone to have, Sulemana does his own thing and often left Manning exposed, Bree is better in this respect as he does not push forward.
I look forward to your reply to this which will start with "I don’t have an unhealthy hatred of him but........................................"  
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 15:55 - Nov 22 with 1121 views | PatfromPoole |
Statistics, eh?
I prefer using my own eyes rather than data, much of which is without context or true meaning. | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 16:08 - Nov 22 with 1114 views | SaintNick |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 15:55 - Nov 22 by PatfromPoole |
Statistics, eh?
I prefer using my own eyes rather than data, much of which is without context or true meaning. |
I have watched with my own eyes Saints go 8 games unbeaten including 6 wins, Manning played the full 90 minutes in 3 of those wins and came on as sub with the scores level and helped us win the game.
Thats the only data that counts, do you agree that this has context and true meaning  | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 16:20 - Nov 22 with 1110 views | PatfromPoole |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 16:08 - Nov 22 by SaintNick |
I have watched with my own eyes Saints go 8 games unbeaten including 6 wins, Manning played the full 90 minutes in 3 of those wins and came on as sub with the scores level and helped us win the game.
Thats the only data that counts, do you agree that this has context and true meaning |
No.
To say that he contributed to the wins against Millwall and West Brom is nonsense.
I cannot cite a simple 4-yard pass to Fraser, who then crossed the ball to Adam Armstrong as a “contribution”.
Sorry.
Same as Mara doing a simple 4-yard pass to Flynn Downes at Hull, before Downes crossed the ball to Fraser for the winning goal. Or chasing their left-winger for 30 yards up the pitch.
These are not game-impacting contributions; they are what should be basic givens.
Neither Manning nor Mara impact on the results of games in a positive way. Regardless of how many 2-yard passes either of them may have successfully completed this season. | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 18:22 - Nov 22 with 1031 views | cocklebreath |
Why is Nick so weird for certain players?
Everyone can see Manning has been poor so far and Mara does nothing. Strange. |  |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 18:49 - Nov 22 with 1008 views | PatfromPoole |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 18:22 - Nov 22 by cocklebreath |
Why is Nick so weird for certain players?
Everyone can see Manning has been poor so far and Mara does nothing. Strange. |
It is all about perspective.
Nick thinks I am the weird one for digging out their negatives.
It’s all good, we can significantly disagree with and respect each other at the same time. | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 19:12 - Nov 22 with 997 views | Berber |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 18:22 - Nov 22 by cocklebreath |
Why is Nick so weird for certain players?
Everyone can see Manning has been poor so far and Mara does nothing. Strange. |
Lower standards? | | | |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 20:32 - Nov 22 with 944 views | felly1 |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 18:22 - Nov 22 by cocklebreath |
Why is Nick so weird for certain players?
Everyone can see Manning has been poor so far and Mara does nothing. Strange. |
Nick's lovely lads... Please add to the list
1. Ryan Manning
2. Sekou Mara
3. Nathan Redmond
4. Wesley Hoet
5. Guido Carrilio
Nicks nasty lads. Please add to the list..
1. Maya Yoshida
2. Kelvin Davis
3. Dan Harding
4. Jack Stephens
5. Broja. |  | | |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 00:50 - Nov 23 with 822 views | saint22 |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 13:12 - Nov 22 by SaintNick |
I meant going forward from now not just judge him on what happened in the past, I was a lone voice in the summer regarding Adam Armstrong about the fact that many judged him on his games in the Premier League and he had now dropped down to the Championship where he was proven.
Im not sure what Ryan Manning has ever done to you, has he dissed Poole in a holiday video or something.
If we take Manning's stats, you are always highly critical of Manning's passing, but if we look at his stats in this, he has passed the ball 963 times in his Championship games, he has a pass completion of 854, that is 88.68 pass completion rate
This puts him above 94% of players in the Championship.
You say he was pretty useless against both Millwall & West Brom, yet against West Brom he came on to the pitch at a time when West Brom had just equalised after dominating the game for the previous 20 minutes and played a part in the winning goal by passing the ball to Fraser.
Yes he did get outjumped for the header, but so do most full backs in that situation, it could be said that he prevented their player getting a free header on goal and picking his spot, have you taken to task our player who left the West Brom man completely free for the header that hit the underside of the bar, clue it wasn't Manning he wasn't on the pitch.
Against Millwall he came on as we got on top of the game and was part of a side that dominated the last 20 minutes and achieved a victory. Bree had done his job and we were now on top, it was time to bring on a more attacking player
Would we have been able to do that in both games carrying a passenger as you are stating.
In these two games, was Manning the only man outjumped for a header ? the only man who gave the ball away ?
Manning may not have had a great start to his Saints career, but he has played a part in our revival, he played the full game in the first 4 games of our unbeaten run and after missing the next two, has come on in the last two games at a time when we were drawing a game and subsequently won it.
To say he has been a complete liability defensively is just not true, in his time on the pitch in the last 8 games, we have conceded just 3 goals in the 403 minutes plus injury time that he has been on the pitch.
Ive nothing against James Bree whom I think has played well, but in the 2 games Manning didn't play any part we conceded 3 goals in just 180 minutes.
Stats are stats and not always a great judge of how a player is playing, but most clubs these days look at them in detail.
All I am saying is give Manning a chance, you have an unhealthy hatred of him |
Bree is a far far better defender than Manning as he has proved in much less game time
Our defence has been much better with Bree playing than manning
Manning is a very average footballer and should be sub at best
End of
I wish people would stop trying to justify him starting there is none
And if only Perraud was here that case would be even more obvious | | | |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 09:25 - Nov 23 with 704 views | SaintNick |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 20:32 - Nov 22 by felly1 |
Nick's lovely lads... Please add to the list
1. Ryan Manning
2. Sekou Mara
3. Nathan Redmond
4. Wesley Hoet
5. Guido Carrilio
Nicks nasty lads. Please add to the list..
1. Maya Yoshida
2. Kelvin Davis
3. Dan Harding
4. Jack Stephens
5. Broja. |
Like everyone I have players that I rate and dont rate, the difference is that you dont get me saying that any of these players are complete and utter rubbish and never contributed anything to Southampton Football Club.
Truth is I find myself sticking up for Manning & Mara because of the criticism that they get and the same could be said in the past of Redmond, Hoet and Carrillo.
What guiles me is the utter fanaticism that means some cannot accept a player whatever he does, if Manning is so terrible and cant defend for instance, how the hell did we win 3 out of the 4 full games he has played in the unbeaten run and only concede 3 goals and how did we win in the two games that we won with late goals after he came on the pitch.
In the game against Hull how on earth did we beat them in the final minutes when we had both Sekou Mara and Ryan Manning on the same pitch !!!!!
Neither have ever made any contribution to Southampton FC, chasing a player back 30 yards and covering for the foraging up field Walker Peters is just part of the job description, just as getting into double figures in goals is part of the job description for a striker, how wrong I was to criticise Broja.
Football is a team game you play as a team and you win, lose or draw as a team,
On certain web pages the saying is "Once a Saint always a Saint" I didn't rate Maya Yoshida or Jack Stephens as players, but I never questioned their commitment, I only ever criticised the flaws in their game that lead to errors when they actually made those errors, not when they were solid in games we won.
I don't think Stephens is better than Bednarek, THB or Holgate, but if he has to play this season he has my 100% backing and if he chases a striker trying to break through in the closing stages and makes a tackle that means we win a game 2-1 then he will get the credit for it, I won't say it is just part of his job description.
Pat is right it is good to all have different opinions, but it is not good to make scapegoats out of players even when they have done nothing wrong and we are winning games | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 10:21 - Nov 23 with 693 views | PatfromPoole |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 09:25 - Nov 23 by SaintNick |
Like everyone I have players that I rate and dont rate, the difference is that you dont get me saying that any of these players are complete and utter rubbish and never contributed anything to Southampton Football Club.
Truth is I find myself sticking up for Manning & Mara because of the criticism that they get and the same could be said in the past of Redmond, Hoet and Carrillo.
What guiles me is the utter fanaticism that means some cannot accept a player whatever he does, if Manning is so terrible and cant defend for instance, how the hell did we win 3 out of the 4 full games he has played in the unbeaten run and only concede 3 goals and how did we win in the two games that we won with late goals after he came on the pitch.
In the game against Hull how on earth did we beat them in the final minutes when we had both Sekou Mara and Ryan Manning on the same pitch !!!!!
Neither have ever made any contribution to Southampton FC, chasing a player back 30 yards and covering for the foraging up field Walker Peters is just part of the job description, just as getting into double figures in goals is part of the job description for a striker, how wrong I was to criticise Broja.
Football is a team game you play as a team and you win, lose or draw as a team,
On certain web pages the saying is "Once a Saint always a Saint" I didn't rate Maya Yoshida or Jack Stephens as players, but I never questioned their commitment, I only ever criticised the flaws in their game that lead to errors when they actually made those errors, not when they were solid in games we won.
I don't think Stephens is better than Bednarek, THB or Holgate, but if he has to play this season he has my 100% backing and if he chases a striker trying to break through in the closing stages and makes a tackle that means we win a game 2-1 then he will get the credit for it, I won't say it is just part of his job description.
Pat is right it is good to all have different opinions, but it is not good to make scapegoats out of players even when they have done nothing wrong and we are winning games |
My main issue here is that there is a clear difference between players doing the bare minimum requirement and actually impacting on games.
Manning's high pass completion is because a lot of what he does is simple, usually a sideways pass inside to a more central player. Rarely does he push us up the pitch with an incisive forward pass.
And his defending is weak. He is slow and positionally poor.
Whereas somebody like Fraser impacts on games when he is on the pitch, as he is often directly involved in crucial goals.
At the other end, Bree is impacting positively as he is defensively sound, and gives Sulemana licence to roam more freely up the pitch.
If scoring 10 goals a season as a striker is a basic requirement, where does that leave Mara???
I'm sure you will be more than aware that Liverpool won the Champions League in 2005 with Djimi Traore in the side, so there are precedents of teams winning games despite carrying poor players.... | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 10:39 - Nov 23 with 689 views | SaintNick |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 10:21 - Nov 23 by PatfromPoole |
My main issue here is that there is a clear difference between players doing the bare minimum requirement and actually impacting on games.
Manning's high pass completion is because a lot of what he does is simple, usually a sideways pass inside to a more central player. Rarely does he push us up the pitch with an incisive forward pass.
And his defending is weak. He is slow and positionally poor.
Whereas somebody like Fraser impacts on games when he is on the pitch, as he is often directly involved in crucial goals.
At the other end, Bree is impacting positively as he is defensively sound, and gives Sulemana licence to roam more freely up the pitch.
If scoring 10 goals a season as a striker is a basic requirement, where does that leave Mara???
I'm sure you will be more than aware that Liverpool won the Champions League in 2005 with Djimi Traore in the side, so there are precedents of teams winning games despite carrying poor players.... |
Simple is quite often good, Steven Davis was not noted for his long passing game, he just got the ball and laid it off for others , Manning's job is to get the ball and lay it to the man in front of him usually Sulemana and then overlap, hence the high number of crosses Manning has put in, but few through balls as the man in front of him likes to drop deep and run at players.
I have never tried to claim Manning is a good defender.
Fraser has impacted on games a lot more, against WBA he got a nice simple ball so he could cross for Armstrong to score, Manning did his job here, if he had turned and did something fancy like cross himself things might have turned out differently.
Bree is a better defender but is not so good going forward, I have said that Bree is a better balance than Manning when paired with Sulemana as the Sulemana doesn't drop in and cover our full back enough, against Millwall RM got the balance right, Bree snuffed out their threat and then as they tired he brought on attacking options, Huddersfield is a poser for Martin, does he need to be defensive against the 3rd poorest attack and defence in the division, horses for courses and with games coming thick and fast he has to get the squad rotation right.
10 goals a season at Premier League level is good going for any striker not playing for a big 7 club, truth is to finish in mid table you need a striker who can get into double figures hopefully 12, a second striker who gets about 8/9 and then a 3rd who can come in and get 6.
After Ings left we had none of these.
Traore wasn't one of the Liverpool greats, but he did have a good 2004/05 season, he wasn't a poor player, just an inconsistent one, on his day Lemina for instance was a class act, but he couldn't do it week in week out, that is the difference between average players, good players and very good players.
Think Chris Marsden's mazy dribble and goal at Ipswich, he could do it, but he only did it once in his Saints career. | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 17:40 - Nov 23 with 605 views | felly1 |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 09:25 - Nov 23 by SaintNick |
Like everyone I have players that I rate and dont rate, the difference is that you dont get me saying that any of these players are complete and utter rubbish and never contributed anything to Southampton Football Club.
Truth is I find myself sticking up for Manning & Mara because of the criticism that they get and the same could be said in the past of Redmond, Hoet and Carrillo.
What guiles me is the utter fanaticism that means some cannot accept a player whatever he does, if Manning is so terrible and cant defend for instance, how the hell did we win 3 out of the 4 full games he has played in the unbeaten run and only concede 3 goals and how did we win in the two games that we won with late goals after he came on the pitch.
In the game against Hull how on earth did we beat them in the final minutes when we had both Sekou Mara and Ryan Manning on the same pitch !!!!!
Neither have ever made any contribution to Southampton FC, chasing a player back 30 yards and covering for the foraging up field Walker Peters is just part of the job description, just as getting into double figures in goals is part of the job description for a striker, how wrong I was to criticise Broja.
Football is a team game you play as a team and you win, lose or draw as a team,
On certain web pages the saying is "Once a Saint always a Saint" I didn't rate Maya Yoshida or Jack Stephens as players, but I never questioned their commitment, I only ever criticised the flaws in their game that lead to errors when they actually made those errors, not when they were solid in games we won.
I don't think Stephens is better than Bednarek, THB or Holgate, but if he has to play this season he has my 100% backing and if he chases a striker trying to break through in the closing stages and makes a tackle that means we win a game 2-1 then he will get the credit for it, I won't say it is just part of his job description.
Pat is right it is good to all have different opinions, but it is not good to make scapegoats out of players even when they have done nothing wrong and we are winning games |
All good fun debating about our fave or non fave players.
Personally I think Manning would look alot better with a back 3 and him as a wingback.
Swansea fans did warn us that he can't defend!
The end of the day he was a freebie and probably not on big money.
Mara upsets me cos we payed 11 million quid and he's so far looked poor in both the Prem and the Championship. | | | |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 19:04 - Nov 23 with 578 views | saintwizzler |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 17:40 - Nov 23 by felly1 |
All good fun debating about our fave or non fave players.
Personally I think Manning would look alot better with a back 3 and him as a wingback.
Swansea fans did warn us that he can't defend!
The end of the day he was a freebie and probably not on big money.
Mara upsets me cos we payed 11 million quid and he's so far looked poor in both the Prem and the Championship. |
Couldn’t agree more hon x
WE AGREE ON | |
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| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 20:15 - Nov 23 with 542 views | felly1 |
| Defensive Headache For Southampton's Russell Martin Against Huddersfield on 19:04 - Nov 23 by saintwizzler |
Couldn’t agree more hon x
WE AGREE ON |
You're so leng bruv.. Bff | | | |
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