| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 09:14 - Jun 24 with 1143 views | Boris_ |
Nick, I get that you're on the club payroll so have to drop these messages in every now and then but the club most definitely are in financial trouble, it doesn't take the brains of a Arch Bishop to work that out.
We have very few sellable assets left to cover the operational costs.
With regards to campaigning for people to renew early to save the club, that's pretty crass of you during these times.
Matchday income ( which includes much more than just Season Ticket Sales ) equates to just over 10% of annual turnover will have minimal effect on whether we can survive or not.
You're a financial advisor, so you well know there's VAT in the £17m matchday revenue and of course the cost of running each match with stewards, policing, catering staff as well as match day sponsorship so the likely net profit of a Season Ticket is less than half of the selling price or around £8m
£8m being around 5% of turnover.
Player wages are 77% of turnover.
Season Ticket renewals will have absolutely no bearing on the survival of the football club.
If players had given away 10% of their wages ( as opposed to conning people in to thinking they had ) then it would have a bigger financial contribution than Season Ticket Holders writing off £600 during the biggest recession ever seen in our lifetime.
Now you know why Cortese said he wasn't bothered if no fans showed up... [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 9:24]
|  |
|  |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 10:13 - Jun 24 with 1078 views | SaintNick |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 09:14 - Jun 24 by Boris_ |
Nick, I get that you're on the club payroll so have to drop these messages in every now and then but the club most definitely are in financial trouble, it doesn't take the brains of a Arch Bishop to work that out.
We have very few sellable assets left to cover the operational costs.
With regards to campaigning for people to renew early to save the club, that's pretty crass of you during these times.
Matchday income ( which includes much more than just Season Ticket Sales ) equates to just over 10% of annual turnover will have minimal effect on whether we can survive or not.
You're a financial advisor, so you well know there's VAT in the £17m matchday revenue and of course the cost of running each match with stewards, policing, catering staff as well as match day sponsorship so the likely net profit of a Season Ticket is less than half of the selling price or around £8m
£8m being around 5% of turnover.
Player wages are 77% of turnover.
Season Ticket renewals will have absolutely no bearing on the survival of the football club.
If players had given away 10% of their wages ( as opposed to conning people in to thinking they had ) then it would have a bigger financial contribution than Season Ticket Holders writing off £600 during the biggest recession ever seen in our lifetime.
Now you know why Cortese said he wasn't bothered if no fans showed up... [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 9:24]
|
Firstly I am not on the club payroll, I just try to tell it how it is and at the end of the day I seek to help the club not hinder it.
You are right the club is in financial trouble, but then again so is every other football club at present .
We do have selleable assets left to cover operational costs, Spurs want Hojbjerg, Im sure someone would want Danny Ings or James Ward Prowse or even Nathan Redmond,.
It is not crass in these times to ask people to renew early, most of the people I know who are season ticket holders are in a financial position to renew, many of them might not do so because of the "better off in my pocket not theirs" mindset, trying to change that mindset is not crass but trying to help the club.
Matchday income is a fraction of the club's income, but season ticket sales are a big amount of cash that comes in during the summer at a time when the club needs cash flow and this season even more urgently than ever.
You can dress it up as net profit VAT or whatever and say that £8 million will have no bearing on the survival of club whatsoever, but if the club has £8 million running costs it cannot meet now then it has a lot of bearing.
Your maths are little flawed In the last accounts player wages were said to be £85 million or 58% of the £149 million turnover not 77% .
The operating costs of the club in 2019 were £156 million so an average of £13 million a month, although this would decrease significantly in the summer months as with no games wages etc reduce with less staff deployed..
So if we can bring in season ticket money now it will be a big help, usually this money would be in by now to cover the summer.
So from this standpoint season ticket sales are essential not just in these times but every year.
No one was conned into thinking that the players had"given" away their wages it was quite clear they had deferred them, you know at least one of those players why not suggest to him that they might like to consider now making it a donation.
Cortese might well have said that he wasn't bothered if fans showed up, but that way of thinking was seen then and more so now as blinkered.
Speak to any football club executive and they will tell you the difference between the clubs is the fans and the clubs ability to financially exploit that fanbase.
The difference in prize money is around £2 million a place, so the difference between money earned through that or TV revenue is not massive between top to bottom in relative terms.
What makes the difference is how much you can milk that fanbase, why do Everton have more season ticket holders than Liverpool ? because Liverpool do not want to sell much of their grounds to a season ticket holder at a cheaper rate who will come every week, they want a "tourist" in through the gates who will spend big in the club shop.
If Liverpool can get 10,000 of these tourists in at an average spend of £300 in the club shop for their one trip to Anfield for the season, that,s an extra £3 million a game, with 30 home games that is £90 million a season and my estimate is conservative, they make 10,000 tickets a game available to members who pay around £40 a season for the privilege. Fans don't matter ! whoever is telling you that has no idea how football clubs are run these days
Liverpoolhave a 20 year waiting list for season tickets, i am not sure how many members they have but lets say 50,000 that is £2 million in membership fees alone, all these people being marketed too week in week out with little chance of actually getting in to Anfield.
Saints are on a far lower scale, but the fact remains if we want to stay ahead of the Watford.s of this world we have to try and build our fanbase and then hopefully profit from them, take away the big six and the rest of us have to scratch around to bring in income and try to keep building it, yes the bulk of the income is from the Premier league and TV money, but what makes the real difference is what you can get from the fans, |  |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 10:32 - Jun 24 with 1057 views | Boris_ |
I think it definitely is crass to be guilt tripping fans in to renewing their season ticket regardless of the likelihood of them actually getting to see any football, during the middle of a recession.
If it was anyone else on this forum saying that, I'd say it was naivety but you I believe are an IFO. About the most irresponsible thing an individual could do financially is to lump their money in to something that a) They won't get to use for many months and b) There is a real risk of them losing every penny, should the club enter administration ( as many may well do over the years )
And all of that for what? People renewing Season Tickets will not have an impact on whether the club survives or not.
Noted on the maths, I skimmed through and quoted the overall wages. Player wages are £58m so a 10% deduction is nearly £6m extra in the bank for the club - a relatively insignificant sum as well but on a par with the money the club would save if STH's renewed regardless.
You must have a very privileged social circle if every single one of your friends can part with £600 for something they can't use.
For the record, I've renewed both of my season tickets and carried the credit over. I just think it's crass to guilt trip others in to doing so. [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 10:35]
| |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 10:51 - Jun 24 with 1032 views | SaintNick |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 10:32 - Jun 24 by Boris_ |
I think it definitely is crass to be guilt tripping fans in to renewing their season ticket regardless of the likelihood of them actually getting to see any football, during the middle of a recession.
If it was anyone else on this forum saying that, I'd say it was naivety but you I believe are an IFO. About the most irresponsible thing an individual could do financially is to lump their money in to something that a) They won't get to use for many months and b) There is a real risk of them losing every penny, should the club enter administration ( as many may well do over the years )
And all of that for what? People renewing Season Tickets will not have an impact on whether the club survives or not.
Noted on the maths, I skimmed through and quoted the overall wages. Player wages are £58m so a 10% deduction is nearly £6m extra in the bank for the club - a relatively insignificant sum as well but on a par with the money the club would save if STH's renewed regardless.
You must have a very privileged social circle if every single one of your friends can part with £600 for something they can't use.
For the record, I've renewed both of my season tickets and carried the credit over. I just think it's crass to guilt trip others in to doing so. [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 10:35]
|
Im not guilt tripping anyone, Im just pointing out why they should consider doing so.
When you say IFO I take it you mean IFA, my job has nothing to do with football, I am merely encouraging people to renew their tickets now rather than wait till september, Im just asking them to do what they will do anyway earlier.
To answer your points
A. yes they ownt use it for many months, probably around 3, but in normal circumstances you renew end of May and dont see a game till mid August, so not a lot of difference in the time scale.
B. They could pay using a credit card and protect themselves should the club go bust.
C.There is also a three month installment plan available , so you can reduce your exposure.
d. The cash flow issues are now, by August they should be solved with payments due next season etc.
I have never said there is an issue with the club surviving, my point has always been about cash flow now when there is no income, you say season tickets will not impact and nor will players gifting the wages, well £6 million from the players and say half the season ticket base renewing will put aaround £14 million in the bank and that will cover July .
What is crass in what I have said, I have merely gave an opinion on the situation and said how Saints supporters can help their club if they are in a position to do so.
For the past decade we have all parted with £600 plus for something we could not use for three months so now is no different.
From the people i have spoken to during lockdown, those that are still working or furloughed are actually telling me they are better off at the moment as they have not been able to spend their money, people have saved much money on travel, not being able to go on holiday,, out to football cinemas restaurants etc.
It's not about being privileged I have never claimed to be so or my friends either, you however have and hopefully having renewed yourself you can now happily suggest for those you know in hospitality who can all afford to renew to follow the example of us poor peasants throwing away our last pennies on something we cant use,
Being considerably richer than us it should not be a financial problem
  | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 11:53 - Jun 24 with 972 views | Boris_ |
Come on Nick you're an IFA ( Mr Pedant ) . There is no way you can professionally encourage people to renew their season tickets as a sensible way of looking after their money through this recession.
I renewed as it's on the BUSINESS and on invoice so won't pay before it starts anyway so no risk for me.
So, in your professional opinion, would you encourage people to renew their season ticket before any announcement on a new season starting? | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:17 - Jun 24 with 956 views | SaintNick |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 11:53 - Jun 24 by Boris_ |
Come on Nick you're an IFA ( Mr Pedant ) . There is no way you can professionally encourage people to renew their season tickets as a sensible way of looking after their money through this recession.
I renewed as it's on the BUSINESS and on invoice so won't pay before it starts anyway so no risk for me.
So, in your professional opinion, would you encourage people to renew their season ticket before any announcement on a new season starting? |
You need to change your IFA if you have one who advises you on whether to invest in season tickets (lol)
I cannot professionally encourage people to invest in season tickets anymore than I can advise them whether to buy beer or bread when they go shopping, a season ticket is a leisure item with no financial return not an investment.
So i can have no professional position on whether it is good or bad to encourage people to renew their ticket, this is about football and their leisure time not to do with finances. | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:24 - Jun 24 with 949 views | cynicalsaint |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 10:13 - Jun 24 by SaintNick |
Firstly I am not on the club payroll, I just try to tell it how it is and at the end of the day I seek to help the club not hinder it.
You are right the club is in financial trouble, but then again so is every other football club at present .
We do have selleable assets left to cover operational costs, Spurs want Hojbjerg, Im sure someone would want Danny Ings or James Ward Prowse or even Nathan Redmond,.
It is not crass in these times to ask people to renew early, most of the people I know who are season ticket holders are in a financial position to renew, many of them might not do so because of the "better off in my pocket not theirs" mindset, trying to change that mindset is not crass but trying to help the club.
Matchday income is a fraction of the club's income, but season ticket sales are a big amount of cash that comes in during the summer at a time when the club needs cash flow and this season even more urgently than ever.
You can dress it up as net profit VAT or whatever and say that £8 million will have no bearing on the survival of club whatsoever, but if the club has £8 million running costs it cannot meet now then it has a lot of bearing.
Your maths are little flawed In the last accounts player wages were said to be £85 million or 58% of the £149 million turnover not 77% .
The operating costs of the club in 2019 were £156 million so an average of £13 million a month, although this would decrease significantly in the summer months as with no games wages etc reduce with less staff deployed..
So if we can bring in season ticket money now it will be a big help, usually this money would be in by now to cover the summer.
So from this standpoint season ticket sales are essential not just in these times but every year.
No one was conned into thinking that the players had"given" away their wages it was quite clear they had deferred them, you know at least one of those players why not suggest to him that they might like to consider now making it a donation.
Cortese might well have said that he wasn't bothered if fans showed up, but that way of thinking was seen then and more so now as blinkered.
Speak to any football club executive and they will tell you the difference between the clubs is the fans and the clubs ability to financially exploit that fanbase.
The difference in prize money is around £2 million a place, so the difference between money earned through that or TV revenue is not massive between top to bottom in relative terms.
What makes the difference is how much you can milk that fanbase, why do Everton have more season ticket holders than Liverpool ? because Liverpool do not want to sell much of their grounds to a season ticket holder at a cheaper rate who will come every week, they want a "tourist" in through the gates who will spend big in the club shop.
If Liverpool can get 10,000 of these tourists in at an average spend of £300 in the club shop for their one trip to Anfield for the season, that,s an extra £3 million a game, with 30 home games that is £90 million a season and my estimate is conservative, they make 10,000 tickets a game available to members who pay around £40 a season for the privilege. Fans don't matter ! whoever is telling you that has no idea how football clubs are run these days
Liverpoolhave a 20 year waiting list for season tickets, i am not sure how many members they have but lets say 50,000 that is £2 million in membership fees alone, all these people being marketed too week in week out with little chance of actually getting in to Anfield.
Saints are on a far lower scale, but the fact remains if we want to stay ahead of the Watford.s of this world we have to try and build our fanbase and then hopefully profit from them, take away the big six and the rest of us have to scratch around to bring in income and try to keep building it, yes the bulk of the income is from the Premier league and TV money, but what makes the real difference is what you can get from the fans, |
"Speak to any football club executive and they will tell you the difference between the clubs is the fans and the clubs ability to financially exploit that fanbase."
Sums it up for me and is why i'm taking the refund.
Deferring refunds to August / possibly September when we knew a couple of months ago there wouldn't be any games for fans to attend and at a time when many people have taken a financial hit is pretty shameless to my mind.
And if they really do need my 120 quid to stay afloat then that suggests they'll be in admin sooner rather than later so i want my funds out now before i get parked in a queue behind protected 'football creditors' - the ones who earn tens of thousands a week, haven't chipped in and will get what their bloated contracts stipulate come what may. |  | | |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:31 - Jun 24 with 939 views | Gennaro_Contaldo |
Seems like there is a lot of scare-mongering around. The club can't be THAT bad a state else they wouldn't be committing to new contracts and would already be making big changes, which we'd hear about in the media.
Conversely, they can't also be THAT reliant upon supporter income as it's a drop in the ocean compared to the riches from TV and marketing.
Just seems like a load of fuss about nothing and more likely, fake news to drive down the purchase price of the club!? |  |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:33 - Jun 24 with 937 views | SaintNick |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:24 - Jun 24 by cynicalsaint |
"Speak to any football club executive and they will tell you the difference between the clubs is the fans and the clubs ability to financially exploit that fanbase."
Sums it up for me and is why i'm taking the refund.
Deferring refunds to August / possibly September when we knew a couple of months ago there wouldn't be any games for fans to attend and at a time when many people have taken a financial hit is pretty shameless to my mind.
And if they really do need my 120 quid to stay afloat then that suggests they'll be in admin sooner rather than later so i want my funds out now before i get parked in a queue behind protected 'football creditors' - the ones who earn tens of thousands a week, haven't chipped in and will get what their bloated contracts stipulate come what may. |
You are probably best out of it given your self professed cynicism and clear distain for football and Saints in general.
The club actually issued refunds to anyone that asked for one, but they did not have the systems in place to do it en masse.
If you truly need the £120 then contact the club directly, given that they have spent much of the summer ringing up supporters who they think could be vulnerable due to age they will be pleased to hear from any that are truly in financial need of £120.
If they refuse to issue the refund to you then please contact me personally and as long as they are willing to pay me the £120 direct in August/September then I will pay you the £120 myself if it is that much of an issue | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:41 - Jun 24 with 924 views | Boris_ |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:31 - Jun 24 by Gennaro_Contaldo |
Seems like there is a lot of scare-mongering around. The club can't be THAT bad a state else they wouldn't be committing to new contracts and would already be making big changes, which we'd hear about in the media.
Conversely, they can't also be THAT reliant upon supporter income as it's a drop in the ocean compared to the riches from TV and marketing.
Just seems like a load of fuss about nothing and more likely, fake news to drive down the purchase price of the club!? |
That's my main point.
The club isn't reliant on supporter income. They could sell PEH and the savings on wage plus the mooted £35m fee would be enough to offset match day income for several years.
Supporter income will make very little if any difference to whether a Premier League club sinks or swims, so supporters shouldn't be made to feel guilty for not renewing at the moment. | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:45 - Jun 24 with 921 views | cynicalsaint |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:41 - Jun 24 by Boris_ |
That's my main point.
The club isn't reliant on supporter income. They could sell PEH and the savings on wage plus the mooted £35m fee would be enough to offset match day income for several years.
Supporter income will make very little if any difference to whether a Premier League club sinks or swims, so supporters shouldn't be made to feel guilty for not renewing at the moment. |
i don't think anyone is 'guilt tripping' supporters are they...? | | | |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:47 - Jun 24 with 913 views | Boris_ |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:45 - Jun 24 by cynicalsaint |
i don't think anyone is 'guilt tripping' supporters are they...? |
Have you read the article in the OP?
"I see too many "I'm waiting till august " posts on social media, that has to change, some Saints supporters have to have a different mindset, people should want to pay as early as possible to help the club, Saints like all clubs have no income at present and have lost that income if the games had been played in front of a crowd." | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:57 - Jun 24 with 909 views | cynicalsaint |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:47 - Jun 24 by Boris_ |
Have you read the article in the OP?
"I see too many "I'm waiting till august " posts on social media, that has to change, some Saints supporters have to have a different mindset, people should want to pay as early as possible to help the club, Saints like all clubs have no income at present and have lost that income if the games had been played in front of a crowd." |
think you may have missed the sarcasm in my reply :-)
football, or the premier league at least, is broken.
I've been a season ticket holder for 42 out of the last 43 years (missed relegation from the championship as i was working abroad for a year) so the suggestion that i hold 'football and saints in distain' (sic) couldn't be further from the truth.
But the goalposts have moved.
Do i need the £120? No. But the club don't know that, and the fact is their approach is all about protecting their cash flow, not mine. And that speaks volumes. [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 12:59]
| | | |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 13:07 - Jun 24 with 888 views | Boris_ |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 12:57 - Jun 24 by cynicalsaint |
think you may have missed the sarcasm in my reply :-)
football, or the premier league at least, is broken.
I've been a season ticket holder for 42 out of the last 43 years (missed relegation from the championship as i was working abroad for a year) so the suggestion that i hold 'football and saints in distain' (sic) couldn't be further from the truth.
But the goalposts have moved.
Do i need the £120? No. But the club don't know that, and the fact is their approach is all about protecting their cash flow, not mine. And that speaks volumes. [Post edited 24 Jun 2020 12:59]
|
What baffles me is that Nick is a Financial Advisor. His job is literally to tell people how best to invest/save their money.
Paying £600 to a football club that:
a) Won't affect whether they sink or swim.
b) Won't know when ( or if ) you can even use your £600 investment.
c) Should the club go in to administration, unless you pay on credit card ( which many people don't have ) then you will lose every penny if the club goes in to administration.
That's about the worst financial advice anyone could give, especially during the start of the biggest recession any of us are ever going to live through. | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 13:03 - Jun 25 with 694 views | 1ASIN12 |
I certainly won't be renewing my season ticket untill th elast day, and dispite what Nick thinks the £500 is better in my pocket right now.
Come the end of August I will know if I have a job or not and therefore be able to justify the outlay.
To be honest to think that fans should renew now when the world is going through its biggest recession in 40 odd years is rather strange.
Some fans (you only have to look at the various Facebook pages) who do believe that the players have given up a % of their wages rather than just defer.
Most clubs will no doubt will be in finacial diificulties right now , just like 50% of most company's - you only have to look at the news each day to see how may people are losing thier jobs. | | | |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 15:29 - Jun 25 with 636 views | Boris_ |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 13:03 - Jun 25 by 1ASIN12 |
I certainly won't be renewing my season ticket untill th elast day, and dispite what Nick thinks the £500 is better in my pocket right now.
Come the end of August I will know if I have a job or not and therefore be able to justify the outlay.
To be honest to think that fans should renew now when the world is going through its biggest recession in 40 odd years is rather strange.
Some fans (you only have to look at the various Facebook pages) who do believe that the players have given up a % of their wages rather than just defer.
Most clubs will no doubt will be in finacial diificulties right now , just like 50% of most company's - you only have to look at the news each day to see how may people are losing thier jobs. |
It's even more mental when you think Nicks profession is literally helping people look after their money and telling them what is good to invest in and what is bad and the risks associated.
Nick appears to be prioritising his relationship with the football club, over the profession he has chosen to be in, which is sad to see. | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 16:29 - Jun 25 with 592 views | djsaint |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 15:29 - Jun 25 by Boris_ |
It's even more mental when you think Nicks profession is literally helping people look after their money and telling them what is good to invest in and what is bad and the risks associated.
Nick appears to be prioritising his relationship with the football club, over the profession he has chosen to be in, which is sad to see. |
i'd love to be a fly on the wall when you have a meeting with your IFA!
Shall i buy beef or pork?
Should i have lager or cider?
What about crisps, can i have crisps?
Should i got to spain on holiday?
What if i buy a new coat for winter?
A season ticket is not an investment! | | | |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 16:48 - Jun 25 with 572 views | Boris_ |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 16:29 - Jun 25 by djsaint |
i'd love to be a fly on the wall when you have a meeting with your IFA!
Shall i buy beef or pork?
Should i have lager or cider?
What about crisps, can i have crisps?
Should i got to spain on holiday?
What if i buy a new coat for winter?
A season ticket is not an investment! |
You're absolutely right it's not. But during a recession an IFA should probably advise his clients that spending £600 on something that you a) Can't use and b) Might lose every penny of without ever using isn't responsible. | |
| |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 18:05 - Jun 25 with 544 views | djsaint |
| Do Media Rumours Suggesting Saints In Financial Trouble Have Foundation ! on 16:48 - Jun 25 by Boris_ |
You're absolutely right it's not. But during a recession an IFA should probably advise his clients that spending £600 on something that you a) Can't use and b) Might lose every penny of without ever using isn't responsible. |
No they shouldn't! | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
