| Injuries 20:14 - Oct 10 with 10419 views | monners1969 |
2 questions
How many fit players do we have?
Do I need to bring my boots and deep heat on Wednesday ? |  | | |  |
| Injuries on 16:23 - Oct 12 with 2709 views | connell10 |
Well that's good news mate , thanks for posting in  |  |
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| Injuries on 16:33 - Oct 12 with 2656 views | sprocket |
| Injuries on 16:23 - Oct 12 by connell10 |
Well that's good news mate , thanks for posting in |
Yeah, it looks like Burrell, Chair and Saito will be back soon enough which is great news. |  | | |
| Injuries on 17:31 - Oct 12 with 2452 views | Stainrod |
| Injuries on 03:43 - Oct 12 by numptydumpty |
Squad Balance is the key
1. Up and coming players
2. Championship level players
3. Potential stars but injury prone
But the stats guys need to look at the types of injuries these players get, with the likelihood, certain injuries reoccur.
And realistically in a squad of 25, we have to work out the likelihood, that with all potential availabilities, we have at teast 16 of this group available at any given time.
Also, in addition to this, our training routines, our matchday tactics, our schedules all need to be carefully managed.
Players being injured in training such as Saito and Lloyd recently and Vale, injured in a match warm up, that should never ever happen. That means that the way they are in these sessions for those particular players was very wrong.
And also I know Stephan said predecided timings for players coming back are his choices alone. Personally, I trust a managers instinct as opposed to a database run by a performance team that is still failing. And especially bringing on a more injury prone player who normally plays on the other side of the pitch.
i am unconvinced still that the importance of the performance teams recommendations is worth much. And am sure also training methods, warming up techniques, to me there has been some shockingly poor advice.
Ultimately we have a far better squad on paper so we can cope with injuries which are inevitable but within our squad we need to have on average at any one time, 16 decent players able to play a part and i would say 9 or 10 minimum of those that could be playing 90 minutes.
This bringing on players to prevent injuries, we are getting this wrong consistently. Personally i think its highly recommended to Stephan, so am sure that would have been the advice.
Yes some of the recruitment has been highly risky, but the balance is still not correct.
Easy to say, but i feel personally our performance team has too much clout and wrong decisions are being made by this team consistently in the advice they give about training, in game management and recruitment.
I think most aspects of our club are perforning admirably, but the guys in the treatment rooms looking at the stats around this are failing. i hope this improves but i have little confidence in them. They have too much clout for me. And its been consistently poor for three seasons.
Appreciate we always have to take some calculated risks with our squad, and yes the schedules are tough but I think we are failing badly with availability and for me those problems mean we need change, aa i have seen no signs of this team learning. [Post edited 12 Oct 3:59]
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Performance team enjoying too much clout?
Think its very hard to reach that conclusion from the outside.
Beale ruined Willock's career.
Stephan seemed to be calling the shots last year on selection and it was no surprise to me when Burrell did his hamstring because he was clearly being massively over-played (albeit Stephan had very few other options).
The danger of fans assessing things like this is we always react to the last game. Fans are disappointed because the performance-led substitutions cost us againsr the Hammers.
But overplay certain players and that's them out for 3/4 months. Loosing key players for that length of time (Chair for instance) is costing us a lot more points than two points (arguably) lost against West Ham. | | | |
| Injuries on 18:00 - Oct 12 with 2373 views | numptydumpty |
| Injuries on 17:31 - Oct 12 by Stainrod |
Performance team enjoying too much clout?
Think its very hard to reach that conclusion from the outside.
Beale ruined Willock's career.
Stephan seemed to be calling the shots last year on selection and it was no surprise to me when Burrell did his hamstring because he was clearly being massively over-played (albeit Stephan had very few other options).
The danger of fans assessing things like this is we always react to the last game. Fans are disappointed because the performance-led substitutions cost us againsr the Hammers.
But overplay certain players and that's them out for 3/4 months. Loosing key players for that length of time (Chair for instance) is costing us a lot more points than two points (arguably) lost against West Ham. |
We are not overplaying players, they have only played nine games so far and had a three week break.
And whatever the perfomance teams advice, which i personally believe is taking into consideration on not playing players more than the allotted time, prior to the game sometimes, the phrase if aint broke dont fix it.
Its not as if this protecting of players has ever worked.
We consistently have at least double figures in players unavailable or only.possible to achieve a few minutes and we still seem to average around two new players out injured each match, this season.
You massively cherry picked my explanations in my post.
Was basing my theory on three seasons not one game. And my explanation looked at a variety of different depaetments input and effect on this.
But yes if as you say we are not overplaying players to prevent time out injured,as in the case of Burrell or Chair last season.
Not sure what point you are making that we are protecting players from injuries this season, to prove the importance of not causing more injuries.
Ie we have been picking up injuries every game.
Beale didnt ruin Willocks career, he was inconsistent anyhow. He is at Cardiff now, so still in the championship. [Post edited 12 Oct 18:00]
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| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 with 2237 views | Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |  | | |
| Injuries on 19:34 - Oct 12 with 2229 views | Northernr |
| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 by Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |
100% agree with this BTW. |  | | |
| Injuries on 19:47 - Oct 12 with 2202 views | Mick_S |
| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 by Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |
That is just absolutely bonkers. Warm downs are to protect against this happening.
I’m very confused. I can understand something may go awry pre match on the pitch, but warm downs? Two of them?
Eh? |  |
| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| Injuries on 20:10 - Oct 12 with 2123 views | kensalriser |
Shouldn't it be cool down? Warm down is too oxymoronic. Not to mention highly annoying. |  |
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| Injuries on 20:48 - Oct 12 with 2025 views | Mick_S |
| Injuries on 20:10 - Oct 12 by kensalriser |
Shouldn't it be cool down? Warm down is too oxymoronic. Not to mention highly annoying. |
Neither of those should hurt. Point taken, though. | |
| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| Injuries on 22:41 - Oct 12 with 1841 views | numptydumpty |
| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 by Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |
The issue being everyone seems to copy everyone else, even if certain practices don't work.
ie When Pep's City players pass around at the back endlessly and possession
football was seen as the only way, everyone copied.
Just because we are doing things the way everyone else does things, it doesn't make it right. | |
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| Injuries on 05:59 - Oct 13 with 1664 views | QPROslo |
| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 by Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |
From what I read it wasn't so much a "warm down" session but a practice game for their players who hadn't played or had only played a few minutes. Apparently they are doing this regularly after matches. [Post edited 13 Oct 5:59]
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| Injuries on 06:33 - Oct 13 with 1623 views | Rsole |
| Injuries on 05:59 - Oct 13 by QPROslo |
From what I read it wasn't so much a "warm down" session but a practice game for their players who hadn't played or had only played a few minutes. Apparently they are doing this regularly after matches. [Post edited 13 Oct 5:59]
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This could work out for us - ensuring everyone gets a three game week, regardless of real game time. |  |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
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| Injuries on 08:54 - Oct 13 with 1473 views | wombat |
| Injuries on 16:33 - Oct 12 by sprocket |
Yeah, it looks like Burrell, Chair and Saito will be back soon enough which is great news. |
thing is for how long ?
if burrell does his hamnstring again forget any big deal for him if he starts scoring on a reg basis. |  |
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| Injuries on 13:09 - Oct 13 with 1307 views | Stainrod |
| Injuries on 18:00 - Oct 12 by numptydumpty |
We are not overplaying players, they have only played nine games so far and had a three week break.
And whatever the perfomance teams advice, which i personally believe is taking into consideration on not playing players more than the allotted time, prior to the game sometimes, the phrase if aint broke dont fix it.
Its not as if this protecting of players has ever worked.
We consistently have at least double figures in players unavailable or only.possible to achieve a few minutes and we still seem to average around two new players out injured each match, this season.
You massively cherry picked my explanations in my post.
Was basing my theory on three seasons not one game. And my explanation looked at a variety of different depaetments input and effect on this.
But yes if as you say we are not overplaying players to prevent time out injured,as in the case of Burrell or Chair last season.
Not sure what point you are making that we are protecting players from injuries this season, to prove the importance of not causing more injuries.
Ie we have been picking up injuries every game.
Beale didnt ruin Willocks career, he was inconsistent anyhow. He is at Cardiff now, so still in the championship. [Post edited 12 Oct 18:00]
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I just don’t agree mate. If we just played players without rotating I think our injuries would be even worse. JCS has never played more than 30 odd games a season and he is 28. The reason why we still have him fit is prob in part because we are resting him in 3 game weeks. Poku is v injury prone, needs kid gloves. Smyth runs v explosively and was getting knocked about a lot mid week. With the benefit of hiindsight we could argue about Kember sure but he stays on, aggregates the groin strain he picked up in the first half and we are without a recognised left back tmrw- then fans wd complain about that too.
Without access to the in play data the backroom staff and coaches have I just don’t see how fans can be quite so definite about how the club should be handling substitutions and rotations differently. | | | |
| Injuries on 20:45 - Oct 13 with 1084 views | JezHoops |
| Injuries on 20:10 - Oct 12 by kensalriser |
Shouldn't it be cool down? Warm down is too oxymoronic. Not to mention highly annoying. |
Is saying “not to mention” just before mentioning that very thing also oxymoronic ? | | | |
| Injuries on 22:06 - Oct 13 with 973 views | numptydumpty |
| Injuries on 13:09 - Oct 13 by Stainrod |
I just don’t agree mate. If we just played players without rotating I think our injuries would be even worse. JCS has never played more than 30 odd games a season and he is 28. The reason why we still have him fit is prob in part because we are resting him in 3 game weeks. Poku is v injury prone, needs kid gloves. Smyth runs v explosively and was getting knocked about a lot mid week. With the benefit of hiindsight we could argue about Kember sure but he stays on, aggregates the groin strain he picked up in the first half and we are without a recognised left back tmrw- then fans wd complain about that too.
Without access to the in play data the backroom staff and coaches have I just don’t see how fans can be quite so definite about how the club should be handling substitutions and rotations differently. |
Yes, no worries Stainrod.
I probably too wordy always and dont explain myself clearly about what I mean Not definite about my ideas either. None of us can be. Its just our uneducated guesswork, of course.
Wasnt suggesting at all, we dont rotate players though, but occasionally in games, also allow for using your own intuition at times. Players playing well and looking strong, and extra twenty minutes at the end of one game. Is that going to make much difference. Could still be rotated, in the next two games of the week.
That was the main point was meant to be suggesting.
But sometimes we do the opposite of this, anyhow still.
For instance, wasnt sure why Dunne was played against Preston. That was rotation, but seemed to be against medical advice. Easy to say after he had a bad game then got little to zero game time for his country recently afterwards. Was he still deemed unfit and yes I know he was put some games on bench as third keeper, which meams they effectively rested him.
I appreciate the advice from performance team, but even ten more minutes on than previously agreed. Is it that much of an exact science. I think the manager should be allowed more of a judgement call at times. Talking about Kemper from that game. Possibly Smith but some said he picked up an injury niggle, so agree with that sub. Kemper didnt seem to be struggling and am not aware he was an injury prone player ever before.
Its a balancing act though, no doubt. [Post edited 13 Oct 22:43]
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| Injuries on 12:39 - Oct 14 with 632 views | W7Ranger |
| Injuries on 20:10 - Oct 12 by kensalriser |
Shouldn't it be cool down? Warm down is too oxymoronic. Not to mention highly annoying. |
Oh chill in will ya?! |  | | |
| Injuries on 14:27 - Oct 14 with 496 views | Stainrod |
| Injuries on 22:06 - Oct 13 by numptydumpty |
Yes, no worries Stainrod.
I probably too wordy always and dont explain myself clearly about what I mean Not definite about my ideas either. None of us can be. Its just our uneducated guesswork, of course.
Wasnt suggesting at all, we dont rotate players though, but occasionally in games, also allow for using your own intuition at times. Players playing well and looking strong, and extra twenty minutes at the end of one game. Is that going to make much difference. Could still be rotated, in the next two games of the week.
That was the main point was meant to be suggesting.
But sometimes we do the opposite of this, anyhow still.
For instance, wasnt sure why Dunne was played against Preston. That was rotation, but seemed to be against medical advice. Easy to say after he had a bad game then got little to zero game time for his country recently afterwards. Was he still deemed unfit and yes I know he was put some games on bench as third keeper, which meams they effectively rested him.
I appreciate the advice from performance team, but even ten more minutes on than previously agreed. Is it that much of an exact science. I think the manager should be allowed more of a judgement call at times. Talking about Kemper from that game. Possibly Smith but some said he picked up an injury niggle, so agree with that sub. Kemper didnt seem to be struggling and am not aware he was an injury prone player ever before.
Its a balancing act though, no doubt. [Post edited 13 Oct 22:43]
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Fair enough mate and thank you for clarifying.
And not at all, me thinks (for what it is worth) you are a good poster….
Sounds like we are not a million miles apart in that case.
Agree subs shouldn’t be entirely pre-determined unless someone coming back from injury; you are right there needs to be a bit of responding to circumstances in the match.
I suppose all I would say is that we don’t know for sure that these are not Stephan’s calls. Or he might be happy to take the medical advice. He also has access to the in-play data so he might be being told that player x is running less or slower or whatever. Hopefully those in the dugout are working as unified team just like the players on the pitch. | | | |
| Injuries on 14:38 - Oct 14 with 471 views | nick_hammersmith |
| Injuries on 20:10 - Oct 12 by kensalriser |
Shouldn't it be cool down? Warm down is too oxymoronic. Not to mention highly annoying. |
No, I've seen these before.
Its normally for unused subs, you can see them in the background during post match interviews sometimes.
The players are made to do an amount of high exertion activity because they were not used in the match, but had presumably already been primed ready to go, so their bodies need to do "something" |  | | |
| Injuries on 16:57 - Oct 14 with 353 views | rbee |
| Injuries on 19:27 - Oct 12 by Ned_Kennedys |
Arsenal had two players injured AFTER their weekend game during their warm down session: there definitely seems to be an increasing problem at the top levels, not just at QPR. |
and not just in football.
Watching the American football on the weekend and players are dropping like flies in almost every game.
My mate out there was telling me that it is an NFL rule that teams have to disclose their injury news. |  | | |
| Injuries on 17:17 - Oct 14 with 300 views | queensparker |
I don’t want to derail this thread into conspiracy theories and paranoia, so I apologise for what I’m about to say, but I have several family members in medicine and it’s a known after-effect of COVID that it can potentially cause issues to muscles / joints / ligaments / recovery.
NOT the vaccine, Covid the actual disease.
Given I imagine everyone in the world including sportsmen has now had the infection at some point, I wonder if this might be a factor. |  | | |
| Injuries on 17:23 - Oct 14 with 280 views | Match82 |
| Injuries on 06:15 - Oct 11 by cpgerber |
Its a big rotten apple in the game at the moment. The Dutch had 6 first choice starters either unavailable before the international break even started, or pulled up injured during it. FIFA, UEFA and the FA’s are burning the players and the game to the ground in their greed for money.
There is no way they will do it, but we absolutely have to revert to a situation where there are fewer games. Just look at the recent premier league logs, usually about 2 teams at the bottom get clobbered and relegated long before season end, indicating there just isn’t enough quality for inflated numbers just to get more games.
Trim the league numbers, reduce the number of cups and ditch the Nations League. And back to smaller Euro comps. Why do they even call it Champions League while it hasn’t been a competitions for champions for ages?
[Post edited 11 Oct 6:18]
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Two easy solutions are getting rid of the league cup (while definitely making it clear that legacy trophies are important, probably count as twice as important as FA cup trophies now that they're limited edition) and reducing Championship to 20 teams.
But instead, why not add an extra game for a few teams by expanding the playoffs to top 8 so we can earn a few more bucks |  | | |
| Injuries on 18:38 - Oct 14 with 121 views | FDC |
| Injuries on 17:17 - Oct 14 by queensparker |
I don’t want to derail this thread into conspiracy theories and paranoia, so I apologise for what I’m about to say, but I have several family members in medicine and it’s a known after-effect of COVID that it can potentially cause issues to muscles / joints / ligaments / recovery.
NOT the vaccine, Covid the actual disease.
Given I imagine everyone in the world including sportsmen has now had the infection at some point, I wonder if this might be a factor. |
Is there evidence of similar issues globally and in other sports? Genuine question I've no idea |  | | |
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