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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 15:10 - Dec 17 by James1980
Sorry I just think it is ridiculous that this negativity rears it's ugly head every time we lose. We were not outplayed on Saturday. To some extent football is a game of small margins and an element of luck, Plymouth were certainly lucky to have got all 3 points It is a shame that when we win there isn't an equal amount of positivity. I would put money on after a good run, a loss would have certain people on here demanding Hill get sacked.
You say "every time we lose" as if it's an uncommon event, we have won just 12 home games in 2 calendar years! P43 W12 D20 L11 we have won 1.3 points per game at home overall and only 1 point per game this season not to mention we are currently averaging just one home goal per game so far as we have since January 2017. If the season tickets had not been cheap there would be no one there.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 21:07 - Dec 17 with 2387 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 20:02 - Dec 17 by 49thseason
You say "every time we lose" as if it's an uncommon event, we have won just 12 home games in 2 calendar years! P43 W12 D20 L11 we have won 1.3 points per game at home overall and only 1 point per game this season not to mention we are currently averaging just one home goal per game so far as we have since January 2017. If the season tickets had not been cheap there would be no one there.
To be fair to James - 'every time we lose' is different to your stats about how many wins (at home) - yes 12 out of 43 isn't thrilling - but we have lost less! Drawing games we should have won seems to be the problem looking at your figures. Certainly 3 games that immediately spring to mind are Oldham and Bradford last season and Luton this season.
[Post edited 17 Dec 2018 21:12]
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 17:04 - Dec 17 by James1980
Taking Saturday in isolation we were unlucky to get nothing from that game. On the subject of not being very good is that the players and or the manager? Who is to say another manager will suddenly turn Rochdale into the Barca of League 1 and is the cost really worth the risk?
You cant blame luck for 18months + of in the main absolute shite negative football whilst worrying too much about every opposition, blindly playing decent players in wrong positions to the teams detriment just to prove a point.
We dont need a manager to turn us into Barca, id gladly settle for someone whos not quite so pissed with his own self importance, that might just select a team worth stumping up the best part of £30 for every home game,and maybe even ridiculously try playing someone up front who can actually score.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 22:45 - Dec 17 with 2238 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 22:28 - Dec 17 by nordenblue
You cant blame luck for 18months + of in the main absolute shite negative football whilst worrying too much about every opposition, blindly playing decent players in wrong positions to the teams detriment just to prove a point.
We dont need a manager to turn us into Barca, id gladly settle for someone whos not quite so pissed with his own self importance, that might just select a team worth stumping up the best part of £30 for every home game,and maybe even ridiculously try playing someone up front who can actually score.
My main issue is we win=indifference, we lose=Hill must go immediately if not sooner.
'Only happy when you've got it often makes you miss the journey'
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 22:45 - Dec 17 by James1980
My main issue is we win=indifference, we lose=Hill must go immediately if not sooner.
It's not just the results. It's the way we're playing, its the baffling team selections and tactics. It's the constant bashing of the fans, the big 'I am' and 'It's never my fault' b*llocks that he pedals all the time.
Like someone has said previously. Any fun we had watching a no-fear, attacking style of football has been completely sucked out of being a Dale fan over the last 18+ month. I think at the moment I just go for the social aspect and out of habit. It certainly isn't out of enjoyment.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 09:16 - Dec 18 with 2060 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 22:45 - Dec 17 by James1980
My main issue is we win=indifference, we lose=Hill must go immediately if not sooner.
The problem is we lose plenty more than we should and win nowhere near enough, people will always criticise when there so many opportunities in which to do so?
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 09:25 - Dec 18 with 2049 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 09:16 - Dec 18 by nordenblue
The problem is we lose plenty more than we should and win nowhere near enough, people will always criticise when there so many opportunities in which to do so?
On the occasions we do win it would be good to see an equal amount of positivity as there is negativity when we lose though. It seems like as far as some are concerned the most important thing for Rochdale is to get rid of Hill.
'Only happy when you've got it often makes you miss the journey'
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 09:25 - Dec 18 by James1980
On the occasions we do win it would be good to see an equal amount of positivity as there is negativity when we lose though. It seems like as far as some are concerned the most important thing for Rochdale is to get rid of Hill.
How can there ever be something in equal measure when one of the eventualities happens much more than the other? The simple fact is Hilly has had a very easy ride so far off the crowd considering some of the shite that's been served up and the negative tactics not to mention the bizzare personnel he pulls out of a hat.
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 09:25 - Dec 18 by James1980
On the occasions we do win it would be good to see an equal amount of positivity as there is negativity when we lose though. It seems like as far as some are concerned the most important thing for Rochdale is to get rid of Hill.
This whole situation we find ourselves in now is somewhat of our own making, imho James.
Firstly, change. In the most part, people generally don't embrace change easily and from my experience, Rochdale folk in particular (sweeping statement obviously as it will never be a one size fits all) are traditional folk with traditional values and a "if it aint broke don't fix it" attitude. Over the last 10 years or so, we got used to winning all of a sudden and aspirations (mine included) were raised but a more sinister word - "expectations" started to creep in. Some of this was not unreasonable. Everything seemed to be going right for us. The books were balanced and looking strong, the ground and bars were ours, the club became a short-term fixture in the top half of league of L1, we had some stonking cup runs topped off by a late equaliser against Spurs followed by scenes and a replay at Wembley (all of which boosted the coffers). Even the beast from the east couldn’t cool the feeling that we had taken a fully deserved step up.
Now, the appearance from the outside is that things are being turned on their head. The structure of the BoD/Chairman who brought a lot of the above success has been rubbed out and redrawn. Not saying it will be better, worse, or the same, just that it’s changed. I won’t comment on the fiscal situation as I know nothing about it. We have had a pretty unsettling changing of the guard at CEO, however, which is there for all to see and whilst it is not a positive, that doesn’t mean it can’t become a positive in the future. Then there’s the on-field stuff. Our league position speaks for itself and has done for some time now. This is exacerbated by our home record, which has seen “Fortress Spotland” crumble into dust, and is a huge concern for both attracting new supporters and keeping current ones. No cup run to speak of in the big one either, but we are still swinging in the Checktrade. Then there’s “the gaffer”. In a results business, we aren’t getting them. That, in and of itself, is a concern. But added to that, there are three recurring issues, which rub fans up the wrong way, namely which players are picked where/tactics, the size and quality of the squad and the interaction of the manager with the fanbase. We all have our favourite players but a singular cry form every Dale fan is to play our leading active goalscorer up front where he can contribute most. I also think most Dale fans would like to see players like Cannon back in midfield where they think he can make a difference but Hill’s told him he’s a defender, so that’s that. I personally would like to see Done get a shot up front with Hendo. Anything to get us back to playing attacking entertaining footy again, even if we lose every week and go down ffs. At least we tried. The feeling at many points last season was that we would go down without trying. The danger is that that mentality creeps back in. The Jan window is coming. Who knows what changes will be made to the squad then. I don’t blame KH for getting it somewhat wrong this season or last as it isn’t an exact science building a team, no matter how much cash you throw at it (ask City, Chelsea and United at various points of their evolution). The downside of getting it wrong, though, is a financial penalty which could mean we have to sell a player before we want. None of us wants that. Then there’s the manager’s attitude. I listened to the interview which was free on iplayer as it was recommended on this forum and thought it was honest, genuine and gave me a better understanding of the many challenges he faces. I very rarely listen to him though. He often gets tongue tied and says things which I wonder if he really means. He is emotional too and gets wound up and is too close to the action. If it were me, I would put Beechy on all post-match duties like Utd did when Fergie went “awol” for press duties. He speaks better, seems more level headed and is a better mouthpiece in my view. I would also send Hilly on a customer awareness course in the summer. His attitude is turning a lot of fans off and in some cases away from the club. That can’t be allowed to continue.
I think you are right in that a lot of fans have now had enough of KH (and the poll on here backs this up to some extent). My position was and still is to give him until the end of the season come what may and make a calculated, balanced decision on the future when the dust has settled. We are not in a crisis. We are still balancing the books. We are in League 1 (the last time I checked). We are still in the Checkatrade. We have a half decent squad and a very promising group of youngsters waiting to break into it. We also need to do a lot of things better in almost every area. Ironically, change is what is actually needed most. Change the fixture board and every other niggle which is wrong with the club and which winds fans up. Change who plays where and the way we play. Improve the number of goals we score and reduce the goals we concede. Get back to “no fear” and “team Rochdale” if that is possible. Ultimately, it may even be that the best thing to do for the club is to change KH. But for me, that time isn’t now. I am sure though, that if the hirsute version has been shown the door at OT, the baldy version will be acutely aware that regardless of past successes, he needs to be evaluating himself and improving his contribution to our improving results now more than ever.
One change we have seen this year is the major signings were two old men well past there peaks and from what has been suggested on here, at the top of the wage scale. I dont recall at any point in KHs tenure , in either spell, that the central part of his recruitment were players of that vintage. Didnt understand it at the time and still dont. It appears that two of our highest paid players arent making the team...what that does for team morale is interesting.
We seem to have switched from taking on broken toys to something more akin to adult toys.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 12:14 - Dec 18 with 1902 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 11:56 - Dec 18 by pioneer
One change we have seen this year is the major signings were two old men well past there peaks and from what has been suggested on here, at the top of the wage scale. I dont recall at any point in KHs tenure , in either spell, that the central part of his recruitment were players of that vintage. Didnt understand it at the time and still dont. It appears that two of our highest paid players arent making the team...what that does for team morale is interesting.
We seem to have switched from taking on broken toys to something more akin to adult toys.
I think that KH said he felt more experience was needed in the team on the field after last season. But another poster could just as easily have said it too. Someone said it anyway. And as Calvin has experience up front, only Perks brings something "extra" in midfield.
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 10:46 - Dec 18 by nordenblue
How can there ever be something in equal measure when one of the eventualities happens much more than the other? The simple fact is Hilly has had a very easy ride so far off the crowd considering some of the shite that's been served up and the negative tactics not to mention the bizzare personnel he pulls out of a hat.
Much more? This season we've 'not lost' 12 league games. (6 wins,6 draws) and we've 'lost' 10 league games.
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 12:14 - Dec 18 by DaleiLama
I think that KH said he felt more experience was needed in the team on the field after last season. But another poster could just as easily have said it too. Someone said it anyway. And as Calvin has experience up front, only Perks brings something "extra" in midfield.
Great post earlier BTW. Didn't KH also say he wanted competition for places because certain players got complacent or something along those lines?
'Only happy when you've got it often makes you miss the journey'
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 10:46 - Dec 18 by nordenblue
How can there ever be something in equal measure when one of the eventualities happens much more than the other? The simple fact is Hilly has had a very easy ride so far off the crowd considering some of the shite that's been served up and the negative tactics not to mention the bizzare personnel he pulls out of a hat.
Have you seen a league table? We haven’t even lost half of our games, so how does it happen much more?
Leader of the little gang of immature cretins.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 17:03 - Dec 18 with 1605 views
It's the fact that there are 3 points for a win which puts greater emphasis on the need to win games. a single point for a draw does not help the seasons total as much as turning draws into wins does. Snatching a draw might not feel like losing but in the long term, it's better to throw caution to the wind and set out to win games. We have not won back to back games since April 3rd 2018 and only managed it twice last season one of which involved 2 away games. The last time we won two consecutive home games was 26th and 30th December 2016 Between the 17th Sept 2016 and 30th December 2016, we won 10 consecutive home games. so the question has to be asked, what happened over Xmas 2016 and New year 2017 to disrupt the team's ability to win games, particularly at home?
Keith Hills father died in Feb 2017, James made the point about him being depressed, he may well be right.
[Post edited 18 Dec 2018 17:42]
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:15 - Dec 18 with 1538 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 17:40 - Dec 18 by 49thseason
It's the fact that there are 3 points for a win which puts greater emphasis on the need to win games. a single point for a draw does not help the seasons total as much as turning draws into wins does. Snatching a draw might not feel like losing but in the long term, it's better to throw caution to the wind and set out to win games. We have not won back to back games since April 3rd 2018 and only managed it twice last season one of which involved 2 away games. The last time we won two consecutive home games was 26th and 30th December 2016 Between the 17th Sept 2016 and 30th December 2016, we won 10 consecutive home games. so the question has to be asked, what happened over Xmas 2016 and New year 2017 to disrupt the team's ability to win games, particularly at home?
Keith Hills father died in Feb 2017, James made the point about him being depressed, he may well be right.
[Post edited 18 Dec 2018 17:42]
KH and the board cacked themselves at the possibility of promotion is what happened.
We were flying, but picked up a few injuries, with bids expected for Hogan, any other club would have invested in a couple of players, we didn't and the dream of ever seeing us in the Championship died. For me, the hope, fun and Team Rochdale simply evaporated during that January and sadly for many I don't think it has returned since.
On Hilly being depressed, as anyone who has lost a parent will know, some days you just cant be arsed. He has also lost his friend and agent soon after. As in the case of Mourinho at United, I bet there are days when Hill would love Dale to sack him and pay him off, I also wouldn't be surprised if Dale is his last job in football, as he just doesn't seem to enjoy it any more.
Everything thats been, has past. The answers in the looking glass!
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:31 - Dec 18 with 1515 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:15 - Dec 18 by SteTsGoldenBoot
KH and the board cacked themselves at the possibility of promotion is what happened.
We were flying, but picked up a few injuries, with bids expected for Hogan, any other club would have invested in a couple of players, we didn't and the dream of ever seeing us in the Championship died. For me, the hope, fun and Team Rochdale simply evaporated during that January and sadly for many I don't think it has returned since.
On Hilly being depressed, as anyone who has lost a parent will know, some days you just cant be arsed. He has also lost his friend and agent soon after. As in the case of Mourinho at United, I bet there are days when Hill would love Dale to sack him and pay him off, I also wouldn't be surprised if Dale is his last job in football, as he just doesn't seem to enjoy it any more.
On your first point of Hilly and the board cacking it at the possibility of promotion, the board maybe but I don't think Hilly was being scared off by it. I had a very fleeting chat with Hilly at that time when promotion had gone and I said to him that has probably cost the club about 4 million quid in total, his reply was more like 8 million and he was not happy about it either.....I can't comment on that figure but that's a hell of a payday for Dale to have missed out on if true....
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:15 - Dec 18 by SteTsGoldenBoot
KH and the board cacked themselves at the possibility of promotion is what happened.
We were flying, but picked up a few injuries, with bids expected for Hogan, any other club would have invested in a couple of players, we didn't and the dream of ever seeing us in the Championship died. For me, the hope, fun and Team Rochdale simply evaporated during that January and sadly for many I don't think it has returned since.
On Hilly being depressed, as anyone who has lost a parent will know, some days you just cant be arsed. He has also lost his friend and agent soon after. As in the case of Mourinho at United, I bet there are days when Hill would love Dale to sack him and pay him off, I also wouldn't be surprised if Dale is his last job in football, as he just doesn't seem to enjoy it any more.
We got promotion when Hogan was with us. He left for Brentford before we even started this stint in League One.
When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf?
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:53 - Dec 18 with 1472 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:15 - Dec 18 by SteTsGoldenBoot
KH and the board cacked themselves at the possibility of promotion is what happened.
We were flying, but picked up a few injuries, with bids expected for Hogan, any other club would have invested in a couple of players, we didn't and the dream of ever seeing us in the Championship died. For me, the hope, fun and Team Rochdale simply evaporated during that January and sadly for many I don't think it has returned since.
On Hilly being depressed, as anyone who has lost a parent will know, some days you just cant be arsed. He has also lost his friend and agent soon after. As in the case of Mourinho at United, I bet there are days when Hill would love Dale to sack him and pay him off, I also wouldn't be surprised if Dale is his last job in football, as he just doesn't seem to enjoy it any more.
Joe Bunney got injured. It was simply that.
Whatever has happened since is a separate issue but that season went off the rails when Bunney was out and it began immediately at Barrow in the Cup with Rafferty at LB and McGahey At RB. We then signed Taylor and Kitching, neither of whom were the answer there for various reasons and the whole side was affected. We sold Bunney at the right time but for that period when we were flying so was he and he was integral to the way we played. It’ll be almost forgotten in years to come (it almost has already) and there were obviously other factors too, but we’d have made the play-offs that season if Bunney has stayed fit and we’d have ended up selling him to someone bigger than Northampton. When he returned he was never the same and nor were we.
What happened from summer ‘17 onwards is where things really started going wrong.
The most annoying part of this whole joke is that the only person heaping all the trouble up for himself is Hill. Just wait till supporters at the games start making criticism vocal.
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Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 19:13 - Dec 18 with 1426 views
Hill in or out? 2nd referendum..... on 18:45 - Dec 18 by TVOS1907
We got promotion when Hogan was with us. He left for Brentford before we even started this stint in League One.
I think he means bids when he was at Brentford - he joined Villa in Jan 17 when we were going well in League 1. Not sure what we could have done though as the Villa deal went through at the last minute on deadline day. It would have been a big risk signing someone on big money then Hogan stayed at Brentford.
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
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