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For this who are unhappy that RM has a clear method of play .....and who feel we should sack our Manager
Good article on the eight relegation candidates in the Championship ....the common factor that links them all - They sacked managers repeatedly...and have developed no method of play ....
" Eight teams are fighting to avoid two relegation spots with short-term approaches holding them back............... What they have in common is the use of the manager conveyor belt. Few have found any degree of philosophy or style, instead overhauling squads to suit the latest dugout dweller, leaving them gasping for air. "
The bottom nine clubs have had 24 managers between them – give or take a caretaker or two – and are reaping what they sowed....................long-term planning is key in football and clubs such as Luton and Nottingham Forest have shown the way out of the Championship "
"clubs such as Luton and Nottingham Forest have shown the way out of the Championship "
The truth is the opposite of what you claim. The clubs down the bottom have changed managers and style, yes, but that's not why they're down there. They're down there because the previous managers failed. So is it wrong for them to change managers? Was it wrong for Wednesday to sack Munoz and bring in Rohl? Of course not. As the article states "if they had started with Röhl in charge they might have been safe by now".
In contrast to what you say, the truth is that clubs like Forest and Luton have escaped the Championship precisely because they have changed manager and style. Forest changed radically. They were bottom when Cooper took over!
Luton under Rob Edwards have been more of an evolution but he has led a change in style from the Nathan Jones era. This is a good video from when Jones was new at Saints, explaining the improvement under Edwards and what ultimately got them out of the Championship:
So, it's wrong to claim clubs don't improve by sacking their manager. In the examples you yourself put up, the exact opposite has happened.
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:25 - Apr 20 with 1385 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:17 - Apr 20 by Ifonly
"clubs such as Luton and Nottingham Forest have shown the way out of the Championship "
The truth is the opposite of what you claim. The clubs down the bottom have changed managers and style, yes, but that's not why they're down there. They're down there because the previous managers failed. So is it wrong for them to change managers? Was it wrong for Wednesday to sack Munoz and bring in Rohl? Of course not. As the article states "if they had started with Röhl in charge they might have been safe by now".
In contrast to what you say, the truth is that clubs like Forest and Luton have escaped the Championship precisely because they have changed manager and style. Forest changed radically. They were bottom when Cooper took over!
Luton under Rob Edwards have been more of an evolution but he has led a change in style from the Nathan Jones era. This is a good video from when Jones was new at Saints, explaining the improvement under Edwards and what ultimately got them out of the Championship:
So, it's wrong to claim clubs don't improve by sacking their manager. In the examples you yourself put up, the exact opposite has happened.
What about the other 8 clubs
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:44 - Apr 20 with 1351 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:25 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
What about the other 8 clubs
As I said, they're down there because previous managers failed. As the examples show, it's totally illogical to claim that means they shouldn't change manager again.
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:47 - Apr 20 with 1342 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:25 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
What about the other 8 clubs
The issue that the article is pointing out is that good managers develop and clear method of play - and that they need to be given time for that to build.
When you change a manager - there is often a new manager "bounce " - but building a strategy around that - which some clubs seem to have done - does not work.
Saints have tended to allow each Manager time to evolve - sometimes they did not.
My argument is that RM is building a clear method of play that works - a significant part of the time - and that he deserves the time - including into next season regardless of Promotion
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 15:08 - Apr 20 with 1317 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:47 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
The issue that the article is pointing out is that good managers develop and clear method of play - and that they need to be given time for that to build.
When you change a manager - there is often a new manager "bounce " - but building a strategy around that - which some clubs seem to have done - does not work.
Saints have tended to allow each Manager time to evolve - sometimes they did not.
My argument is that RM is building a clear method of play that works - a significant part of the time - and that he deserves the time - including into next season regardless of Promotion
RM's style works for us in the Championship because we have good quality players by Championship standards. The success of his style depends totally on having good quality players, which isn't the case with other styles. At Swansea his style would produce a mid table team - as it did.
If we are promoted, we will no longer have good quality players by the standard of the league, so the style will probably fail. Burnley dominated the Championship playing possession football and have bombed in the PL. If RM was the sort of manager who adapted his style, he could survive. To be fair, he has shown signs of adapting, including on Tuesday. But overall, he's very rigid and only has a plan A. That plan A won't work long term in the PL, so really we're better off without him. But unfortunately he'll still be here next season so you can stop worrying.
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 17:06 - Apr 20 with 1239 views
Yeah but that’s nonsense as so many times this season we could’ve put games to bed but didn’t due to his tactics, and just messing around with the ball at the back is what’s cost us, with most of our non results since the Bristol game showing that, with our most recent ones proving it even more! As we were lucky against Watford but certainly weren’t today. As his tactics worked magic for a large period, but ever since Huddersfield sussed us out it’s not been the same since and that’s what’s been costing us.
And seeing how we had the 2nd best squad in the league we should be finishing second really, yet todays game has well and truly confirmed playoffs, and if we don’t win then then he should go. As there’s a reason why very few managers that only just get their teams up and outta the championship last in the prem
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:47 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
The issue that the article is pointing out is that good managers develop and clear method of play - and that they need to be given time for that to build.
When you change a manager - there is often a new manager "bounce " - but building a strategy around that - which some clubs seem to have done - does not work.
Saints have tended to allow each Manager time to evolve - sometimes they did not.
My argument is that RM is building a clear method of play that works - a significant part of the time - and that he deserves the time - including into next season regardless of Promotion
RM has never won anything. Where’s the evidence that it works?
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:47 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
The issue that the article is pointing out is that good managers develop and clear method of play - and that they need to be given time for that to build.
When you change a manager - there is often a new manager "bounce " - but building a strategy around that - which some clubs seem to have done - does not work.
Saints have tended to allow each Manager time to evolve - sometimes they did not.
My argument is that RM is building a clear method of play that works - a significant part of the time - and that he deserves the time - including into next season regardless of Promotion
Don’t want to see him sacked and do believe in consistency / longevity of managers in post, but I wouldn’t care a jot if RM wasn’t here next year.
Ready and waiting to mop up those European places......
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 14:47 - Apr 20 by SaintEPW
The issue that the article is pointing out is that good managers develop and clear method of play - and that they need to be given time for that to build.
When you change a manager - there is often a new manager "bounce " - but building a strategy around that - which some clubs seem to have done - does not work.
Saints have tended to allow each Manager time to evolve - sometimes they did not.
My argument is that RM is building a clear method of play that works - a significant part of the time - and that he deserves the time - including into next season regardless of Promotion
We know what RM’s method of play is; that’s the problem…..so does the rest of the league. A decent manager can ‘mix things up’ so we are not so predictable.
Ready and waiting to mop up those European places......
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 17:33 - Apr 20 with 1154 views
if his way doesnt get us promoted with the players we have,just imagine playing the same way when all the better players have gone,we will become like his previous clubs
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 09:00 - Apr 21 with 805 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 17:33 - Apr 20 by saintmark1976
After today’s shambolic performance and result I don’t imagine that there would be a lot of takers of your proposal SaintEPW.
Agree- as at 5 pm yesterday - I was in the Sack The Manager state - especially looking at the nature of the defeat. I was pissed off for sure - at so many aspects of what decisions were made by RM
I'm going to try and calm down - and have a think
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 09:42 - Apr 21 with 752 views
Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 09:00 - Apr 21 by SaintEPW
Agree- as at 5 pm yesterday - I was in the Sack The Manager state - especially looking at the nature of the defeat. I was pissed off for sure - at so many aspects of what decisions were made by RM
I'm going to try and calm down - and have a think
Sorry,I do not want Martin as Manager next season. Martin has had a strong squad this season,we should be in an automatic position but now we limp into the playoffs with massive concern over the most important positions,Goalkeeper and Forwards. I don’t think he knows his best team, he has no plan B to close down games or rescue them.He throws his substitutes about like confetti with no strategy. The club captain doesn’t appear to be a first choice for the team which is frankly ridiculous. Can we imagine playing the way we do having lost our best players. With Martin in charge we will survive in the Championship if we’re lucky.
[Post edited 21 Apr 9:44]
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Saints should Keep RM whether we get Promoted or Not on 13:15 - Apr 21 with 607 views
I'm in the not sure camp but tend to think give him next season. Keep changing the manager very rarely works. It certainly didn't do us any favours getting rid of Ralph last season. Rotherham got rid of Matt Taylor and have been even worse. Birmingham brought in Rooney, now they are being relegated and so on.
Sometimes the grass isn't greener. What can a manager do, if a player misses from 2 yards with an open goal ahead of him? It doesn't matter what tactics you play, missing open goals from 2 yards cannot be trained or planned for. Again, bit like Middlesbrough at home, if Adams scores his easy chance at one nil, we win the game. If Brooks made it 2 nil yesterday, we win the game. Win those two and we are in the automatics, in a record breaking season for points totals. Yes ifs and buts, but if a professional player misses such easy chances, I would suggest they arn't good enough.
I blame the players yesterday for missing easy chances and not defending properly. It wasn't tactics. We created loads of chances with the tactics employed, and our strikers missed them all, even open goals that I could have scored.
As I said last season, change the manager if you like, but with the same owners, it will just be like for like, with the same poor players, loan players who know they won't be here much longer, and we would probably be worse.
In my opinion, comparing us with some of the teams in the lower third of the league is not correct.
We have had many more advantages than most of them in that we had perhaps four/five players with recent PL pedigree, a decent fan base and whilst I disagree with RM's "system", at least a plan to play to. The fact that the "plan" fails to account for the strengths/weaknesses of the opposition, is beyond some players and apparently only lasts 75 minutes in any match, is galling and frustrating, but there is a method.
Changing managers and having managers looking over their shoulders at the Board is not good. Having a squad rounded out with kids is not good. Having the pressure of dropped points meaning more to them than us, is not good. So overall I think the comparison is false.
Would I keep RM next season? Clearly nobody is asking my opinion on this but I'll put up a thread on my view.
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