| Looks like the rats are finally leaving 08:56 - Jul 27 with 2941 views | Butty101 |
Jwp (not a rat)looks nailed onto west ham
Lavia off to scouse c&nts
Caleta car off to Lyon
Also Burnley are meant to have bid 9mill for Tella. |  |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:04 - Jul 27 with 2912 views | grumpy |
9 million for Tella are they joking? |  | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:16 - Jul 27 with 2877 views | Ron11 |
I've said this many times before, but one more time.
Tella goes, Che Adams leaves and Lavia sulks off - put Stuart Armstrong in as a striker with the other Armstrong. Stuey already showed what he's still capable of against Bournemouth.
And in Russell Martin we do at least have a manager who actually knows what Stuey can do and has also made his views on the subject known.
It makes me wonder if Stuart was in and and out of the side quite a lot under the last three dipsticks in charge because they didn't like the fact that he was smarter than they were. |  | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:34 - Jul 27 with 2842 views | SonicBoom |
I mean Ron, that is a thought I guess.....
However Stuey has the reputation for being one of those players that only wants to play when he's 100% fit. If he was as good as you think then surely one of the last 3 managers would have relied on him.
Add to that, he is not a striker.
And finally I would not want to rely on Adam Armstrong for goals given his woeful goal return over the last 2 years.
In the championship you need goals and this suggestion does not exactly scream goals does it. |  | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 11:00 - Jul 27 with 2719 views | Ron11 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:34 - Jul 27 by SonicBoom |
I mean Ron, that is a thought I guess.....
However Stuey has the reputation for being one of those players that only wants to play when he's 100% fit. If he was as good as you think then surely one of the last 3 managers would have relied on him.
Add to that, he is not a striker.
And finally I would not want to rely on Adam Armstrong for goals given his woeful goal return over the last 2 years.
In the championship you need goals and this suggestion does not exactly scream goals does it. |
I liked his well taken goal against Bournemouth....couldn't do any worse than Che Adams | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 11:13 - Jul 27 with 2689 views | Butty101 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:04 - Jul 27 by grumpy |
9 million for Tella are they joking? |
That’s exactly what I thought. Good enough to be in the championship team of the year and must be worth 15mill.
What makes me laugh is that they spent a fortune on a keeper that played in div 1 on loan | |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 11:30 - Jul 27 with 2640 views | kingslandstand1 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 11:13 - Jul 27 by Butty101 |
That’s exactly what I thought. Good enough to be in the championship team of the year and must be worth 15mill.
What makes me laugh is that they spent a fortune on a keeper that played in div 1 on loan |
Maybe they think we're desperate for the cash? Lets' just hope with all these ship leavers going SR start doing a Daniel Levy to get the best deal possible. Trouble is you pi55 off those players as was apparently evident with Lavia |  | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 12:11 - Jul 27 with 2602 views | TimSaint |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 11:13 - Jul 27 by Butty101 |
That’s exactly what I thought. Good enough to be in the championship team of the year and must be worth 15mill.
What makes me laugh is that they spent a fortune on a keeper that played in div 1 on loan |
Tella scored 17 league goals, 2 FA Cup goals and 5 league assists.
He made the EFL team of the season.
He has 2 years left on his contract.
Prem Burnley offer a paltry £9m ? Come back when you can double it. |  |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 12:40 - Jul 27 with 2547 views | Berber |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:04 - Jul 27 by grumpy |
9 million for Tella are they joking? |
About what we pay for Man City academy graduates. Would say that we need to keep Tella and hope he can replicate the form. |  | | |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 18:14 - Jul 27 with 2286 views | saint901 |
What a very odd and disturbing attitude.
Football players are professionals. They will play for whomever pays them. They are no different to any other employee whether the work is making widgets on a production line to high end financial trading.
Any individual - professional sport player or otherwise - wants to get the maximum reward for their work. Sometimes (most times) that's in the form of higher salary. Sometimes (less often) it's being recognised as being expert in a particular field. It can be other things. Basically anything that the individual values.
Loyalty to an employer is a fallacy. I employ some people and I expect them to do the job I pay for - am delighted if they do more - but I do not expect them to stay if they get a better offer. Why should a player in a sports team be any different?
The days of clubs being peopled by local boys have been gone since the 1960's. Even if we had players who live within say 40 miles of Southampton, why should they be prepared to stay if somebody else is offerign more for the same job? | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 20:17 - Jul 27 with 2172 views | Butty101 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 18:14 - Jul 27 by saint901 |
What a very odd and disturbing attitude.
Football players are professionals. They will play for whomever pays them. They are no different to any other employee whether the work is making widgets on a production line to high end financial trading.
Any individual - professional sport player or otherwise - wants to get the maximum reward for their work. Sometimes (most times) that's in the form of higher salary. Sometimes (less often) it's being recognised as being expert in a particular field. It can be other things. Basically anything that the individual values.
Loyalty to an employer is a fallacy. I employ some people and I expect them to do the job I pay for - am delighted if they do more - but I do not expect them to stay if they get a better offer. Why should a player in a sports team be any different?
The days of clubs being peopled by local boys have been gone since the 1960's. Even if we had players who live within say 40 miles of Southampton, why should they be prepared to stay if somebody else is offerign more for the same job? |
So you give your employee a 4 year contract with a big signing on fee, then at the end of that 4 years you pay them a loyalty when they leave? Thought not! You are comparing apples to pears sunshine | |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 20:20 - Jul 27 with 2165 views | onedannywallace |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 18:14 - Jul 27 by saint901 |
What a very odd and disturbing attitude.
Football players are professionals. They will play for whomever pays them. They are no different to any other employee whether the work is making widgets on a production line to high end financial trading.
Any individual - professional sport player or otherwise - wants to get the maximum reward for their work. Sometimes (most times) that's in the form of higher salary. Sometimes (less often) it's being recognised as being expert in a particular field. It can be other things. Basically anything that the individual values.
Loyalty to an employer is a fallacy. I employ some people and I expect them to do the job I pay for - am delighted if they do more - but I do not expect them to stay if they get a better offer. Why should a player in a sports team be any different?
The days of clubs being peopled by local boys have been gone since the 1960's. Even if we had players who live within say 40 miles of Southampton, why should they be prepared to stay if somebody else is offerign more for the same job? |
Sorry but I don't agree. I know I am lucky to have always had a good job but I have always been loyal to my employers unless they did something specific to upset me. I never left just because somebody offered more money (and in the 1980s in London lots of companies regularly did offer a lot more money!) I know lots of people who think the same way and many are still there 30 years later.
I do agree that people will only be loyal if they get something in return - but that something is often respect and an enjoyable working environment with friendly and helpful colleagues.
I expect loyalty from my team - and usually get it but not always. It hurts me personally when people in my team leave because somebody is paying them more, although I understand it when they are young and the extra money helps them to put a deposit on a house.
Lots of people are professionals who will not work for whoever pays them (unless they have no choice). So this is not an excuse for footballers. | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:25 - Jul 28 with 1973 views | saint901 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 20:17 - Jul 27 by Butty101 |
So you give your employee a 4 year contract with a big signing on fee, then at the end of that 4 years you pay them a loyalty when they leave? Thought not! You are comparing apples to pears sunshine |
The way players are paid is a function of the market.
You but them for a period and at the end of that period you promise them a bonus. The terms of the bonus are between you and the employee.
The problem here is use of the word "loyalty".
It's not. It's a contractual reward that is a legal obligation of the employer.
It's entirely possible to have a contract with no such terminal sum if that was whet the market for players wanted.
SO no, I'm comparing apples and apples. | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:31 - Jul 28 with 1965 views | saint901 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 20:20 - Jul 27 by onedannywallace |
Sorry but I don't agree. I know I am lucky to have always had a good job but I have always been loyal to my employers unless they did something specific to upset me. I never left just because somebody offered more money (and in the 1980s in London lots of companies regularly did offer a lot more money!) I know lots of people who think the same way and many are still there 30 years later.
I do agree that people will only be loyal if they get something in return - but that something is often respect and an enjoyable working environment with friendly and helpful colleagues.
I expect loyalty from my team - and usually get it but not always. It hurts me personally when people in my team leave because somebody is paying them more, although I understand it when they are young and the extra money helps them to put a deposit on a house.
Lots of people are professionals who will not work for whoever pays them (unless they have no choice). So this is not an excuse for footballers. |
I have no issues with your view nor your experience but I'm saying that the popular view that the more you pay the more loyalty a player should show towards a club, is a myth.
Some players will stay - Le Tiss for example - regardless of temptation. And they stay for all sorts of reasons but ultimately because they get something they value. In the case of Le Tiss, he had the "best player at the club", "adored by fans", "has to use his undoubted ability perhaps two/three times a game" (by that I mean at a "big" club he would have needed to be brilliant all the time).
You mention you had an enjoyable working environment and helpful colleagues.
All of these things are reasons for staying but in many cases there are just as many for leaving and expecting loyalty which goes beyond the end of a contract is naive. | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:35 - Jul 28 with 1959 views | Butty101 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:25 - Jul 28 by saint901 |
The way players are paid is a function of the market.
You but them for a period and at the end of that period you promise them a bonus. The terms of the bonus are between you and the employee.
The problem here is use of the word "loyalty".
It's not. It's a contractual reward that is a legal obligation of the employer.
It's entirely possible to have a contract with no such terminal sum if that was whet the market for players wanted.
SO no, I'm comparing apples and apples. |
Your apples taste like pears.
Loyalty has nothing to do with it. The difference is that a footballer can be made to stay for the duration of that contract. Your employee can turn round and give you notice that they are off. Add in the fact that football is not a "normal" business, you are way off. | |
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| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 13:23 - Jul 31 with 1619 views | saint901 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 09:35 - Jul 28 by Butty101 |
Your apples taste like pears.
Loyalty has nothing to do with it. The difference is that a footballer can be made to stay for the duration of that contract. Your employee can turn round and give you notice that they are off. Add in the fact that football is not a "normal" business, you are way off. |
Again, I disagree.
Look at financial businesses. Golden hello - fixed term contract with bonuses - often a terminal bonus provided they don't lose too much money.
Look at other sports - all pretty much the same as football.
Just because a football club is not like the greengrocer on the corner employing people week to week or casually, does not mean it's abnormal. Normal is normal for the market that the clubs, regulators and parties have created. Short of breaking the whole thing, it is normal.
The market dictates the terms = normal.
Players who have a fixed term contract but want to move are almost never held to their contract. That is because the club does not want a liability on the pitch and does not want to pay a lot of money to somebody whose role on match days is to clean the dressing rooms.
In terms of "loyalty" - I was staying on message for this thread.It was basically that we should expect players to be loyal beyond the contract terms and not allow themselves to be sold or seek alternative employment and that the more we pay them the stronger that loyalty bond should be. I was pointing our that there is no connection between payment and loyalty. | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 14:43 - Jul 31 with 1500 views | Ronnie |
It is also often in the best interests of the club to sell players, so its unfair to label the players as rats leaving the ship. We now have cover for Lavia so it will be good business to see him leave for £30+ mil, as well as good cover generally in midfield as well as at right and left back, so it will benefit the club to move players on - its too simple to say players who want to move are disloyal. Our squad is currently too big, so the sooner we trim it the better, and then hopefully know who is in the first team picture. | | | |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 15:20 - Jul 31 with 1461 views | Butty101 |
| Looks like the rats are finally leaving on 13:23 - Jul 31 by saint901 |
Again, I disagree.
Look at financial businesses. Golden hello - fixed term contract with bonuses - often a terminal bonus provided they don't lose too much money.
Look at other sports - all pretty much the same as football.
Just because a football club is not like the greengrocer on the corner employing people week to week or casually, does not mean it's abnormal. Normal is normal for the market that the clubs, regulators and parties have created. Short of breaking the whole thing, it is normal.
The market dictates the terms = normal.
Players who have a fixed term contract but want to move are almost never held to their contract. That is because the club does not want a liability on the pitch and does not want to pay a lot of money to somebody whose role on match days is to clean the dressing rooms.
In terms of "loyalty" - I was staying on message for this thread.It was basically that we should expect players to be loyal beyond the contract terms and not allow themselves to be sold or seek alternative employment and that the more we pay them the stronger that loyalty bond should be. I was pointing our that there is no connection between payment and loyalty. |
I think you need to reread the thread as you have gone totally off piste. No one other than you was questioning loyalty.
You said your workers can up an leave if they get a better offer. A footballer can’t unless he has a specific term in his contract, the club is remunerated or his contract expires. Quite simple really
No compartassion to your average joes job | |
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