| Messi - Discuss 09:19 - Dec 19 with 2024 views | SaintNick |
The media is in overdrive about him being the greatest player of all time, but do the stats add up ?
Firstly he has won his first World Cup at the 5th attempt I think, scraping home in a penalty shootout.
Secondly he has spent all his career up to last year at one club, Barcelona who are in a two horse race for the Spanish League in all but two of his seasons there, then he went to PSG who had won 7 out of the last 9 seasons French League titles.
So at club level he has never really took on a challenge, unlike Ronaldo who has won Titles at three different clubs including Juventus .
No doubt that he is one of the World's greats, but its a team game and he is being judged by the number of things.
I hate the tw*t but there is a case for Renaldo being greater, at least he has moved clubs and never been afraid of a challenge
The whole greatest player thing is based on the fact that he has now won the World Cup.
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| Messi - Discuss on 10:04 - Dec 19 with 1972 views | cocklebreath |
Messi over Ronaldo all day and Messi doesn’t look like aplastic Dean Gaffney although not sure about the weird love island lingerie thing he wore to lift the cup |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 10:07 - Dec 19 with 1978 views | SaintNick |
| Messi - Discuss on 10:04 - Dec 19 by cocklebreath |
Messi over Ronaldo all day and Messi doesn’t look like aplastic Dean Gaffney although not sure about the weird love island lingerie thing he wore to lift the cup |
I fairness I have paid little attention to the career of either Messi or Ronaldo, im just not convinced that either are the best players ever, of course all eras in football differ, but I still don't think they are the best | |
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| Messi - Discuss on 10:23 - Dec 19 with 1965 views | PatfromPoole |
You’re making yourself look silly here.
Just look at the goalscoring records of Messi and Ronaldo.
Each of them have been hugely prolific over the best part of two decades.
Who else can compare?
Please don’t say Mo Salah. |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 10:41 - Dec 19 with 1952 views | Wints76 |
It is hard to say who is the best as there are various attributes that some have that others don't but we are fortunate to have lived through the careers of Messi and Ronaldo and been able to watch all of their games. It is Messi for me as I have found him a joy to watch and was told to keep an eye out for him by a local on a trip to Barcelona in 2004 just before he broke through. His dribbling skill looks effortless and he is more of a team player for me than Ronaldo.
However, Ronaldo is more of an athlete and probably a more powerful player. He had tested himself at other clubs (if United, Read, Juve at the given times are a test). Hard to argue with either of their records or longevity
The other argument is that the likes of Best, Pele and Maradona did it on much heavier pitches and with defenders being allowed to kick them
Maradona or Messi for me |  | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 11:00 - Dec 19 with 1936 views | SaintNick |
| Messi - Discuss on 10:23 - Dec 19 by PatfromPoole |
You’re making yourself look silly here.
Just look at the goalscoring records of Messi and Ronaldo.
Each of them have been hugely prolific over the best part of two decades.
Who else can compare?
Please don’t say Mo Salah. |
As I said Im not very up on what either have done, is it only strikers that can be considered the World's best ?
Anyway
Ronaldo
949 club games 701 goals / 196 international games 118 goals
0 world cups
5 Ballon d'ors
Messi
853 club games 701 goals / 172 international games 98 goals
1 World Cup
7 Ballon d'ors
Pele
700 club games 655 goals/ 92 International games 77 goals
3 World Cups
7 Ballon D'ors
On the fact of it I would say Messi just about shades Ronaldo although only just in my view.
But Pele is still over and above the pair of them in terms of stats, World Cup wins and of course his victory over Germany for the allies | |
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| Messi - Discuss on 11:51 - Dec 19 with 1899 views | Southamptonfan |
Messi for me. He has more assists and he has a better personality. The world's best ever player in my opinion. |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 12:35 - Dec 19 with 1872 views | dwayne_dibley |
West Falklands t0sser |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 13:18 - Dec 19 with 1844 views | TripleNiemi |
| Messi - Discuss on 11:51 - Dec 19 by Southamptonfan |
Messi for me. He has more assists and he has a better personality. The world's best ever player in my opinion. |
Messi for me (but only just above Redders) |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 13:36 - Dec 19 with 1824 views | SFC_Referee |
Gotta be Messi at the end of the day, as he gets Ronaldo not only on the pitch, but off of it as well!
As you don’t ever see any major issues around moral, clashes with the coach, wanting to force his way out etc… under Messi (who was even willing to take a pay cut to try and stay at Barca), yet with Ronaldo you’ll be lucky to go a season without him having one of his little breakdown tantrums, followed by interviews from clowns like piers Morgan (who looked like a complete idiot after what he posted about the World Cup before it started!).
And then for what they do on the pitch, their stats are very close, with Messi being more of a team player whilst Ronaldo’s just that one player star sorta type. But Messi does beat him under more areas, and is also the one who does still have a club today where he’s still performing well at.
So for me, bit of a no brainier and that World Cup final yesterday only goes and wraps it up for me |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 14:03 - Dec 19 with 1811 views | felly1 |
I've never come across a player like Messi who has blinding pace, dribbling skills, visionary passer and a natural finisher.
Always a joy to watch, a true footballing phenomenon that we've been lucky to watch in our lifetimes. | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 15:56 - Dec 19 with 1722 views | saint22 |
Really?
Messi is the GOAT
this is no discussion anymore
Look at his games goals stats comp'd with Pele Maradona
And now winning the WC trumps Ronny
Done | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 20:09 - Dec 19 with 1589 views | kingolaf |
| Messi - Discuss on 15:56 - Dec 19 by saint22 |
Really?
Messi is the GOAT
this is no discussion anymore
Look at his games goals stats comp'd with Pele Maradona
And now winning the WC trumps Ronny
Done |
Stats suggest Pele, which I 100% agree with. | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 09:41 - Dec 20 with 1479 views | SonicBoom |
Messi is the best I've ever seen. He constantly delivers and is just so good to watch.
Ronaldo is just a great individual but you can see from his current behaviour that it's all about him. Look at the Messi's team mate were so happy for him.
I don't buy the narrative that you can't be the greatest if you haven't won the world cup. That's ridiculous, where you are born is just an accident of geography. You might be the next Messi and be born in the Pharaoh Islands, score 2000 goals and yet you can't be the best? |  | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 09:52 - Dec 20 with 1469 views | SaintNick |
| Messi - Discuss on 09:41 - Dec 20 by SonicBoom |
Messi is the best I've ever seen. He constantly delivers and is just so good to watch.
Ronaldo is just a great individual but you can see from his current behaviour that it's all about him. Look at the Messi's team mate were so happy for him.
I don't buy the narrative that you can't be the greatest if you haven't won the world cup. That's ridiculous, where you are born is just an accident of geography. You might be the next Messi and be born in the Pharaoh Islands, score 2000 goals and yet you can't be the best? |
I agree there were loads of great players who didn't win the World Cup and loads that did, why does it have to be an attacking player, there have been some great defenders.
In no particular order George Best, Stanley Mathews, Eusebio, Bobby Moore, Franz Beckenbaur were all great players who have not had a mention on here. | |
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| Messi - Discuss on 10:07 - Dec 20 with 1460 views | felly1 |
| Messi - Discuss on 09:52 - Dec 20 by SaintNick |
I agree there were loads of great players who didn't win the World Cup and loads that did, why does it have to be an attacking player, there have been some great defenders.
In no particular order George Best, Stanley Mathews, Eusebio, Bobby Moore, Franz Beckenbaur were all great players who have not had a mention on here. |
It's always been the attackers that are regarded as the best players, simply because it's the most exciting aspect of football and probably the most difficult to be really good at.
Look at Saints and who is regarded as our best three players.
Most wouldn't argue with Lee Tiss, Paine and Channon. All attackers.
As for the GOAT, I would say there is also a case for Johan Cruyff.
A supreme creator and goalscorer. | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 10:15 - Dec 20 with 1454 views | SaintNick |
| Messi - Discuss on 10:07 - Dec 20 by felly1 |
It's always been the attackers that are regarded as the best players, simply because it's the most exciting aspect of football and probably the most difficult to be really good at.
Look at Saints and who is regarded as our best three players.
Most wouldn't argue with Lee Tiss, Paine and Channon. All attackers.
As for the GOAT, I would say there is also a case for Johan Cruyff.
A supreme creator and goalscorer. |
I forgot about Cruyff and you are right it is easy to see why it is the attackers that take the plaudits | |
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| Messi - Discuss on 11:52 - Dec 20 with 1412 views | GRIM |
| Messi - Discuss on 10:15 - Dec 20 by SaintNick |
I forgot about Cruyff and you are right it is easy to see why it is the attackers that take the plaudits |
We'll never know who's the GOAT.
You cannot compare players of different era's.
All of those mentioned were / are great players but judging them against each other just doesn't work.
There's been some great defenders but they don't get a mention (ie. Beckenbauer)
Past & present they've all entertained us over the years.
Just wonder who will be the next player to join the ever increasing list of GOATS. | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 16:46 - Dec 20 with 1272 views | kingslandstand1 |
Thoroughly pi55ed off with this thread - What is a GOAT!!!
Oh, Messi more than likely but that could also be because every single match he plays in is televised and he continually plays on grass that may as well be a snooker table, unlike Pele and Best who were kicked from pillar to post and played on mud baths but still managed some absolute classic pieces of football (from what we have seen)
Pele also won his 1st WC at 17 or 18, than added another 2 to that tally, but Best never even won the Home Championships (I don't think)
Very difficult to judge in different eras |  |
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| Messi - Discuss on 17:11 - Dec 20 with 1261 views | kingslandstand1 |
| Messi - Discuss on 16:46 - Dec 20 by kingslandstand1 |
Thoroughly pi55ed off with this thread - What is a GOAT!!!
Oh, Messi more than likely but that could also be because every single match he plays in is televised and he continually plays on grass that may as well be a snooker table, unlike Pele and Best who were kicked from pillar to post and played on mud baths but still managed some absolute classic pieces of football (from what we have seen)
Pele also won his 1st WC at 17 or 18, than added another 2 to that tally, but Best never even won the Home Championships (I don't think)
Very difficult to judge in different eras |
Greatest Of All Time  | |
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| Messi - Discuss on 19:40 - Dec 20 with 1187 views | Apex |
Hi Nick, I used to sit next to you at At the Del and we saw many great ball players there like Matt and people should remember that he scored thirty goals from the midfield and if he was not told to take corner kicks he would have scored more. Messi is a midfielder so it is not fair to judge the player on how many goals he has scored. Ronaldo is a great striker but lets face it he mostly relied on good service and he had better opportunities to score playing up front than Messi. All I would say to supporter younger than me (and that covers a lot) is this, people like Matt and Messi are special and I mean really special but if you cannot see that special gift they have then I feel sorry for you. Maybe if you take a look at some old videos of a younger Messi in his prime and Ronnie O Sullivan on his A game best scoring a 147 in five minutes you might then appreciate that these as Tina would sat were simply the best, and we will never see the like again.
Cerris | | | |
| Messi - Discuss on 02:40 - Dec 21 with 1006 views | Scoot |
Pele's states are fales. Even he has said that for club level. WC is different they're well documented.
Maradona only lasted 12 or so years.
Messi, Ronaldo, Maradona & Pele have all been kicked to fvck on the pitch but are rarely injured.
We no Messi & CR7s states are fact so for me it's Messi the GOAT. broke every record in Spain & for the national team, more balon-dors than anyone else & won everything he possibly could. What more can he do? | |
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